Mormon Stake President R. James Molina, Doesn't Have The Cojones To Go Through With Announcing Lyndon Lamborn's Excommunication, After Being Exposed!!

Mormon leader declines to announce ouster
Lawn Griffiths, Tribune

Lyndon Lamborn was excommunicated from the Mormon church for doubting some of its claims, but on Sunday his stake president backed away from a plan to publicly announce his ouster.

Mormon ousted as an apostate

Stake President R. James Molina wouldn’t tell the Tribune why he refrained from making the announcement at the eight wards under his leadership.
Molina had told the Tribune last week that he intended to have bishops publicly announce the discipline taken against Lamborn, a fourth-generation member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, as a warning that he may spread blasphemy about the church.

Lamborn, 49, had gone before a disciplinary council of male elders on Aug. 19 where excommunication was ordered. Molina, president of the Mesa Arizona Salt River Stake, wrote to Lamborn in a letter dated Sept. 2, stating that “because of the nature of your excommunication and your involvement with the people of this area, an announcement will be delivered to the Melchizedek Priesthood quorums and Relief Society in each of the wards in our stake ... Sept. 23, 2007, that you have been excommunicated for apostasy.”

Excommunication allows him to be at church events, but not have membership privileges, wear temple garments or tithe.

Such a public announcement about an excommunication in the church is extremely rare, Mormon leaders confirmed.

It’s not clear whether Molina’s announcement was withheld as a result of the publicity the issue has garnered or whether he intends to do it at a later date.

Lamborn said Thursday he went to the Thunder Mountain Ward meeting Sunday expecting the announcement, then asked Molina why nothing happened. Lamborn said the stake president told him “I haven’t made a final decision.”

Molina said Thursday that the Lamborn issue “is a private matter, so I don’t have anything to say to you guys on it.”

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It's obvious to anyone with half a brain, exactly what happened here; Lyndon Lamborn went to the press and exposed R. James Molina's plan to humiliate and embarrass him and his family to the entire Stake, before R. James Molina got the chance to carry out his devious plan.

Fortunately, for people like Lyndon, Mormon Bishops and Stake Presidents like R. James Molina, are so stupid, clueless, caught up in their ego, and their so called "authority and power" and utter arrogance, devoid of any inspiration from on high; that they think that people like Lyndon would NEVER DARE question his so called "authority" or "spirit of discernment" and do what he did, by beating him to the punch and making it public.

Lyndon thwarted Jimmy's little plan of personal destruction and war that he was looking forward to starting, with Lyndon and his innocent family members and friends.

People like R. James Molina have no human decency, don't care what pain their pointless, unjustified actions will cause, because it's all for the cult, because the cult is TRUE, Joe's a Prophet, the BOM is true...at any cost. Mr. Molina is hoping that by "being the man", he can maybe get a promotion within the corporation and maybe become a Seventy or gasp...even an Apostle?

After all, there is an opening since James E. "GOLD FILLINGS" Faust kicked the bucket and I'm sure he thought this might earn him some serious brownie points, by being a hard-ass for Joseph, Hinckley and the Mormon Jesus. Only problem; he was too dumb and lacking of any common sense, insight, inspiration or discernment, to realize what could possibly happen and ultimately did happen, by having the whole thing blow up in his face.

So much for his promotion eh? In fact, I'm pretty sure that he got a severe scolding and tongue lashing from the goons sitting on their golden thrones in Salt Lake City, for bring so much needless controversy and negative publicity to the Mormon cult.

The Mormon Hierarchy is desperate and really on their heels right now, trying to counter the power of the Internet. They are constantly running from and trying to cover up the truth of their history, their evil, vile and horrific teachings and doctrines, their countless lies, their racism, bigotry, homophobia, sexism, hate and condemnation of ALL other people and religions("whores of all the earth", "abominations", "Harlots", "False", "Corrupt", "of the Devil"), full exposure of the lack of any Book of Mormon artifacts, archeology, DNA, etc, and this was the last thing they needed right now.

Anyway, I greatly admire Lyndon and his courage for taking these thugs straight on and winning. They look horrible and he looks like a great, honest guy, who stood up for himself, the truth and his family and in turn, was treated unfairly, dishonestly and un-Christlike.

The Mormon cult and their cult leader Molina look like the fools they are, always have been and always will be....excommunicating a good guy for simply reading "REAL" Mormon history, found in "OFFICIAL" Mormon books(currently sold at Mormon owned and run Deseret/Seagull/BYU bookstores) and then discussing it with others, like family members and friends...GASP!!

I had no idea that simply reading and studying TRUE Mormon history, out of their official books(that they sell daily and profit from) and then discussing it with friends and family, would warrant an immediate excommunication and announcement to the entire Stake. It appears to me that "THEY'VE LOWERED THE BAR!!"

They should be ASHAMED of themselves!!

I guess Boyd K. Packer wasn't kidding, when he said the following:

"You seminary teachers and some of you institute and BYU men will be teaching the history of the Church this school year. This is an unparalleled opportunity in the lives of your students to increase their faith and testimony of the divinity of this work. Your objective should be that they will see the hand of the Lord in every hour and every moment of the Church from its beginning till now."

"There is no such thing as an accurate, objective history of the Church without consideration of the spiritual powers that attend this work."

"Church history can be so interesting and so inspiring as to be a very powerful tool indeed for building faith. If not properly written or properly taught, it may be a faith destroyer."

"There is a temptation for the writer or the teacher of Church history to want to tell everything, whether it is worthy or faith promoting or not. Some things that are true are not very useful."

"That historian or scholar who delights in pointing out the weaknesses and frailties of present or past leaders destroys faith. A destroyer of faith—particularly one within the Church, and more particularly one who is employed specifically to build faith—places himself in great spiritual jeopardy. He is serving the wrong master, and unless he repents, he will not be among the faithful in the eternities."

"One who chooses to follow the tenets of his profession, regardless of how they may injure the Church or destroy the faith of those not ready for “advanced history,” is himself in spiritual jeopardy. If that one is a member of the Church, he has broken his covenants and will be accountable. After all of the tomorrows of mortality have been finished, he will not stand where he might have stood."

and finally:

"Remember: when you see the bitter apostate, you do not see only an absence of light, you see also the presence of darkness.

Do not spread disease germs!

Let's also remember that it was Boyd K. Packer(in "To Young Men Only"-AKA "The Little Factory Talk", General Conference Priesthood Session, October 2, 1976), advocating physical violence toward others, when he said:

"While I was in a mission on one occasion, a missionary said he had something to confess. I was very worried because he just could not get himself to tell me what he had done.

After patient encouragement he finally blurted out, "I hit my companion."

"Oh, is that all," I said in great relief.

"But I floored him," he said.

After learning a little more, my response was "Well, thanks. Somebody had to do it, and it wouldn't be well for a General Authority to solve the problem that way"

I am not recommending that course to you, but I am not omitting it. You must protect yourself."

Uh...yeah, Boyd K. Packer should have been excommunicated a LONG TIME AGO!!

So, I guess Boyd K. Packer wouldn't mind you guys also punching him in the face and "dropping him" too, if you're around him and don't like him, or something that he says or does? So have fun folks, just following his advice of using physical violence, that has the official "Packer Stamp of approval" for missionaries, but also prepare yourself for the ensuing lawsuit from Jesus' "one and only true" lawyers...LOL!!

I'm just guessing that if you can't even criticize them when the criticism is true(Dallin H. Oaks), that they won't let you get away with punching them in the face.

DAMN HYPOCRITES!!

Samuel the Utahnite

Lyndon Lamborn, "Mormon Apostate", Excommunicated By Stake President R. James Molina, For Simply Discussing "THE TRUTH" About Mormon History!!

This is truly another amazing story and example of what the Mormon cult is really all about, at its core. Lyndon Lamborn has been excommunicated by his Stake President, for simply discussing with others, like family members, "the real truth" of Mormon history, found in "official Mormon sources" and I felt that everyone should read this story and have a place to comment on it.

I can't wait to hear what you TBM/Mormon apologists have to say, in defense of your cult this time. There's already a Mormon apologist nut-job(ironically using the name "Mystified Mormon") going to town over on the East Valley Tribune website and I get nauseated just reading his excuses and justifications of his Mormon cult leaders.

I guess to you clueless clowns, NO Mormon leader has EVER said or done anything wrong and they are literal deity, right? Oh yeah, but you don't worship your leaders, rather Jesus Christ, right? What a joke!!

Anyway, it's good to be back writing on my blog and I apologize to everyone for my long absence, while I was dedicating myself to getting my YouTube videos up and running strong, which they now are.

In just over 2 months, thanks to all of you out there, I've had over 240,000 hits and over 7,000 comments, on the 142 videos now posted there, along with 157 subscribers, which will continue to grow and help expose the Mormon cult for the fraud it is.

I also want to give a big thanks to Chimyron, Demon of Kolob, JHuston7, Elder Joseph, Bringumyoung and all of the other ex-Mormons who are doing an outstanding job over on YouTube and other places, exposing the Mormon cult through their videos and allowing me and others to post their videos, while also posting my videos and commenting on them. The greater the exposure, the better!!

I'd also like to give a special welcome to Euilibrium83 who just joined the mix by exposing his former, asshole, masturbation and fear obsessed mission president Allan Pratt, who presided over the France Toulouse Mission. I'll be posting those videos here in the next day, so that you can watch them all here, so check back.

Anyway, you'll all be hearing a lot more from me in the next few days and future, as I'm going to once again dedicate myself to my blogs, podcasts and Skypecasts, with a lot of exciting things coming up, which I'll be letting you all know about soon.

Here is the article regarding Lyndon Lamborn's experience with the Mormon cult's witch hunt of him, ensuing excommunication and then their goal of public humiliating and trashing of him, his character and family. The Mormon Hierarchy's goal, is to publicly DESTROY, DISCREDIT and EMBARRASS anyone that discovers the "REAL TRUTH" and then talks about it publicly, with others or even their own family.

Like Lyndon says in a comment, responding to the article:

"When I first confronted my bishop about my findings and questions, he immediately went into 'damage control' mode. I mentioned in confidentiality that I had been discussing the issues with my brothers. The following week, my bishop had contacted the bishops of ALL my brothers, and they each received a visit from the 'Men In Black'. I honestly felt I was in 1939 Nazi Germany. Real life is stranger than fiction!"

Like Hinckley always says..."isn't it wonderful?!!" NOT!!
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Mormon Ousted As An Apostate
Lawn Griffiths, Tribune

Being excommunicated for apostasy by the Mormon church is one thing, but Lyndon Lamborn is livid that his stake president has ordered bishops in eight Mesa wards to take the rare step of announcing disciplinary action against him to church members today.

“I thought if he could go public, so can I,” said Lamborn, a lifelong member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, who said his research into church history gave him “thousands of reasons the church can’t be what it claims to be.”

Stake President R. James Molina acknowledged Friday he intends to have Lamborn’s excommunication announced to the wards at men’s priesthood meetings and womens Relief Society gatherings, even with Lamborn now taking his case public. Molina, as well as officials at church headquarters in Salt Lake City, call such a public warning about an ousted member extremely rare.

They say, however, church members must be protected from what discordant ex-followers may say to damage the church.

In a letter to Lamborn dated Sept. 2, Molina noted that a disciplinary council had been held Aug. 19 and excommunication was ordered. Lamborn, 49, a Mesa resident who has been a priesthood leader for 20 years, was informed he was no longer a church member, could not “enjoy any membership privileges, including the wearing of temple garments and the payment of tithes and offerings.”

He could attend public meetings if his conduct is orderly, but would be denied giving any talks, offering prayers, partaking of the sacrament or voting.

“Because of the nature of your excommunication and your involvement with people in this area, an announcement will be delivered to the Melchizedek Priesthood quorums and Relief Society in each of the wards in our stake ... on Sunday, September 23, 2007, that you have been excommunicated for apostasy,“ Molina wrote.

“We need to let people know if there is a danger to them, such as him teaching doctrine that is contrary to what is taught by the church,” Molina said Friday.

Lamborn, a member of the Thunder Mountain Ward, said his Mormon roots go back generations, with a great-grandfather in the famed Mormon Battalion that trekked from Iowa to San Diego in 1846 and 1847.

Lamborn served a two-year Mormon mission in 1977-79 in Belgium, was elders quorum president four times and led a Mormon Boy Scout troop. Most recently, he said he was assigned to teach older men in his ward and held other roles.

But everything changed in early 2005. Lamborn, an engineer employed at Boeing in Mesa for nearly 25 years, was asked by a work colleague about the wives of church founder Joseph Smith. She had read “Under the Banner of Heaven: A Story of Violent Faith” by John Krakauer and asked Lamborn if what she had read was accurate.

Smith, the first LDS prophet and president, had at least 33 wives by many accounts.

“Well, I had no knowledge of multiple wives, so I did some research, including using the church’s own genealogical Web site, familysearch.org,” Lamborn said.

He found the information concurred with the book. “Nonmembers seemed to know more about the personal life of Joseph Smith than me,” he said.

Lamborn conducted further research, which led him to question many church teachings. He said he went to Molina with his questions, but received no definitive answers.

Lamborn has been attending the three-hour ward meetings with his wife and 16-year-old son. His two daughters, 22 and 24, “are totally out of Mormonism.”

He said he learned that his five brothers “were doing the same research and arriving at the same conclusions” and doubts, he said. The same was true for his best friend since childhood. In a meeting earlier this summer with Molina, Lamborn acknowledged that he wanted to give up his church membership.

“I was planning to leave the church quietly, but was denied that opportunity, presumably because I was speaking openly to other members about my findings and (was) writing things down,” Lamborn said.

Lamborn has compiled his research into a lengthy testament called, “Search for Truth 6/07,” in which he states: “There comes a time in the life of many church members when the desire to know the truth about the church becomes stronger than the desire to believe the church is true.”

He said he intends to continue to accompany his wife, Nancy, to ward services. “It is tough to go, tough to attend, but I enjoy the fellowship,” he said.

He said he has no desire to join another church, adding that the Mormon faith has many merits, such as its strong family values and its internationally recognized welfare system to help those in need.

The public announcement of his excommunication will be toughest on his wife, Lamborn said. “There’s the embarrassment,” he said. “Friends won’t know how to treat her. The awkwardness. It is going to be tougher on her than anybody.”

Clark Hirschi, manager of the area relations division in Salt Lake City, said Friday he talked to Molina after the stake president was contacted by the Tribune.

“Despite the fact that he has told you this is going to happen, it is up to the priesthood leaders,” Hirschi said. “There may be a letter read to some of the adult members this Sunday. It might be in a few weeks. It may not happen. That is going to be at the discretion and call of the stake president.”

Hirschi said he has never been in a meeting in his own 20 years as a Mormon where a public announcement about an excommunication has been made. He said he had only heard of one being made in a neighboring stake.
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I tried posting the following comment over on the East Valley Tribune site, where the article is located, but I guess the comment is too long, as it wouldn't allow me to post it.

Anyway, here is the full comment that I wrote, addressing this issue and publicly inviting Lyndon to come on the "Mormon Truth Podcast" and tell his story:

Lyndon, I first want to say that I'm sorry your going through this and I also commend you on your courage to take on the Mormon cult and their lies regarding their true history and teachings, which they pretend don’t even exist, were never taught, etc. I also came to same shocking conclusion you did back in 2005, once I discovered “the real truth” regarding Mormonism and it’s history, teachings and doctrines.

I’ve spent the last 2 years of my life, time and money, passionately writing on my blogs, recording podcasts and posting videos, that expose the Mormon cult for what it truly is. The horrific racist teachings of Brigham Young(along with many other Mormon Prophets and Apostles) regarding blacks being cursed as “the seed of Cain” and “cursed with a flat nose and black skin”, “being literal representatives of Satan on earth” was what put me on the path to “the real truth.”

It was devastating to me and my family and I’ve lost several family members and friends from my life for asking them simple questions like, “did you know that Joseph Smith was a polygamist?” They told me that I should be ashamed of myself for speaking such lies about their beloved Prophet Joseph Smith(who only had ONE WIFE EMMA and who would never do something so awful and evil), especially being a returned missionary and they cut me and anyone that associates with me, out of their life instantly....as it was just that simple for them, as the church ALWAYS comes first, even before family and loved ones..

My niece had just been taught in seminary that year, that polygamy started and ended with Brigham Young and was just to help out the widows. And some of you Mormons out there wonder why people don’t know that Joseph Smith was a polygamist? Where does the Mormon Church and hierarchy, in it’s official history, books, manuals or teachings, state that Joseph Smith was a polygamist.

In 30+ years of membership, including lifelong, devout church attendance, 4 years of seminary, 2 months in the MTC and 2 years on my mission and 5 years at BYU institutute...never once did they teach a single word about Joseph Smith’s polygamy...so don’t be so quick to judge us Mormons. When have they ever discussed publicly, the polygamy of Joseph Smith and details of who his wives were, how old they were, that they were happily married to other men, etc? Have they ever taught this in General Conference? Why not?!!

I challenge ANY of you die-hard Mormons and Mormon apologists out there reading this(melting down and screaming LIAR...LIAR), to go to the official Joseph Smith website...JosephSmith.net...and show the world where it openly discusses Joseph Smith’s other wives and emphatically states that Emma WASN’T his only wife and that it wasn’t just a “Joe and Emma” love affair, as they present to the world. I then want you to explain to everyone why there is no mention of his other wives, on the “official” Joseph Smith website, if they are indeed so open and honest about it and have NOTHING to hide.

Oh, by the way, My wife and her entire family were also lifelong members and had NEVER heard about Joseph Smith’s polygamy and the same is true for almost all of my family and friends, who have called me a liar and cut me off, as they are taught to do. Just associating with or sympathizing with an “evil apostate” like me or Lyndon, is forbidden and will get you excommunicated, because we’re so dangerous with “the truth” we now know.

In fact, on the interview with Larry King, when asked about polygamy, current Mormon Prophet Gordon B. Hinckley said “I condemn it, yes, as a practice, because I think IT IS NOT DOCTRINAL. It is not legal. And this church takes the position that we will abide by the law.” “It is not doctrinal?” Really? What was Joseph Smith, Brigham Young and all the others doing then?

Oh and by the way, it was illegal back in their time and they were clearly violating the laws of the land. Also, why did Joseph Smith publicly deny and lie about being a polygamist till his death, calling those that accused him of it to be perjurers? So, Joseph Smith is a proven liar, using his own words...and I again challenge anyone to prove what I’ve said to be false!! Warren Jeffs is the modern day version of Joseph Smith, following Joe’s teachings to a perfect T and if Joe was around today, he’d be rotting in prison and on trial too, just like his buddy and follower Warren Jeffs.

These are the lies that Lyndon and all of us ex-Mormons/apostates are talking about, that terrifies the Mormon cowards/apologists like this Stake President R. James Molina, who is a disgrace in the cover-up of the Mormon cult and all of the skeletons in their closet, that are currently falling all over the ground, for the world to clearly see(which the Mormon hierarchy denies repeatedly). Does Jimmy actually believe that Lyndon is lying? Really?!!

Does Mr. R. James Molina even know that Joseph Smith was a polygamist, married to 14 year old Helen Mar Kimball, against her will and that of her mother, holding her entire family’s eternal life and destiny in the balance, basically threatening her and her parents with damnation and fear?

What about all the happily married women, as mentioned in the article, that Joseph Smith forced to marry him? They don’t exist either, right Mormons? So Familysearch.org is also lying and now considered to be anti-Mormon as well?

Yes, us apostates are the liars and completely delusional, right? How can the Mormon Hierarchy and leadership consider “OFFICIAL MORMON DOCTRINE and HISTORY” to now be anti-Mormon? Maybe they should be excommunicated for lying about it every single day? Aren’t they just condemning and further embarrassing themselves in their attempts to blatantly lie and cover-up further than they already have?

So, you can now be excommunicated from the Mormon cult for just discussing their “actual, real history”, that is currently being sold and profited from at Mormon owned and run Deseret/Seagull and BYU bookstores? Shouldn't they seriously be held to the same standards as the members are and be excommunicating themselves, starting with Gordon B. Hinckley and Sheri L. Dew, for even allowing this evil “anti-Mormon literature” to be sold at THEIR bookstores? Give me a break!!

If we aren’t even allowed to even discuss “REAL, OFFICIAL” Mormon history now and will be singled out and publicly excommunicated for it; why should they be allowed to sell it and profit from it? What HYPOCRITES!!

Lyndon, I want to offer you the opportunity and forum to be able to tell your COMPLETE, UNEDITED STORY to the world through an interview on my "Mormon Truth Podcast", available to the world through my blog and iTunes. Just follow the link here to my main blog, which links to my podcasts or Google “Mormon Truth” or “Mormon Truth Podcast” and you’ll easily find me, my blogs, podcasts and Email address if you are interested. There will be no time limit and you can either just record your story yourself, on your own time and forward it to me or do an interview directly with me. You can also search the term “Mormon”, under “podcasts” on iTunes and find my 4 podcasts in the top 25.

The 3 part interview that I did with Joy was very revealing, as she was able to tell her story of how they treated her and her gay friend, who eventually, through his depression, tragically committed suicide. Joy’s father is currently married to TWO LIVING WOMEN(divorced civilly from her Mother), at the same time, in the Mormon temple, which is another secret the Mormon Hierarchy desperately try to cover up(despite Hinckley having to sign off on it and approve of it), that proves they still believe and allow polygamy as we speak.

Lyndon, I get over 30,000 downloads a month of my podcasts and growing and this will be a GREAT opportunity for you to get your story and experiences out there, for all to hear, if you would like to do that. I just wanted you know that you will ALWAYS have a place to tell your story when you're ready and that I'm 100% in support of you and on your side!!

Thanks again Lyndon for having the courage to go public and tell the world “The TRUTH”, about the Mormon cult and how they’ve treated you, I wish you the best and I hope to hear back from you soon.
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As always, I look forward to everyone's comments!!

Samuel the Utahnite

New Mormon Movie About Emma, One Of Joseph Smith's 33 Wives, Once Again Pretending That She Was His ONE AND ONLY Wife, Just Like JosephSmith.NET Says

Here is a direct link to the video the assholes at KSL deleted!!

Another bullshit propaganda piece put out by Mormons from the "Joseph Smith family organization"(M. Russell Ballard is a direct descendant of Joseph Smith) and strongly supported and promoted by Mormon owned and operated KSL(Jesus' personal TV station) and the Mormon cult(headquartered in Salt Lake City , Utah, and led by Prophet of fraud Gordon B. Hinckley); this time praising Emma, who probably was a great woman, who had to suffer and live with the filthy, perverted asshole and self-proclaimed "King of the world, God-ordained, serial adulterer" Joseph Smith, who was the founding Prophet of fraud, of the Mormon cult of shame.

Mormon scripture(Doctrine and Covenants, 135:3) says that Joseph Smith is "2nd only to Jesus Christ" in greatness of all men that ever lived, but the "very humble", "like a lamb to the slaughter" Joseph Smith himself claims to have done more than Jesus Christ ever did, thus contradicting Mormon scripture yet again.

Joseph Smith said:

"I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him; but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet." (History of the Church, vol. 6, p. 408-409)

Any Mormons out there that want to call me a liar and claim that he never said what I just posted above? I challenge you all to dispute it and prove me WRONG!!

Here is how Joseph Smith really went to the slaughter, as I referenced above and it wasn't like a lamb folks, rather in a gun battle, where he KILLED two men in cold blood. Jesus Christ wasn't killing anyone when he was beaten, hung and nailed to a cross, was he, you true-believing, Mormon hypocrites out there?

If Joseph Smith had truly been emulating Jesus Christ, he would have just stepped up, opened the door and taken the bullets with no problem at all, because that's what a TRUE martyr would have done, right?

Don't ever tell me again TBMS(because now you know "THE REAL TRUTH") that Joseph Smith went like a lamb to the slaughter and was a martyr for Mormonism...because he simply wasn't and died like he lived his life, in rebellion and destroying human life, only thinking of himself till the bitter end.

Maybe if he hadn't been hungover from getting drunk the night before, he might have been able to move around better and dodge the bullets, since he'd also removed his garments and they couldn't protect him.

In the official history of the church, John Taylor says:

He, however, instantly arose, and with a firm, quick step, and a determined expression of countenance, approached the door, and pulling the six-shooter left by Brother Whellock from his pocket, opened the door slightly, and snapped the pistol six successive times; only three of the barrels, however, were discharged. I afterwards understood that two or three were wounded by these discharges, two of whom, I am informed died. (History of the Church, vol. 7, pp.102-3).

Regarding Joseph Smith and the others drinking wine the night before he was killed in Carthage:

"Before the jailer came in, his boy brought in some water, and said the guard wanted some wine. Joseph gave Dr. Richards two dollars to give the guard; but the guard said one was enough, and would take no more. The guard immediately sent for a bottle of wine, pipes, and two small papers of tobacco; and one of the guards brought them into the jail soon after the jailer went out. Dr. Richards uncorked the bottle, and presented a glass to Joseph, who tasted, as also Brother Taylor and the doctor, and the bottle was then given to the guard, who turned to go out..." (History of the Church, vol. 6, p.616).

"Sometime after dinner we sent for some wine. It has been reported by some that this was taken as a sacrament. It was no such thing,; our spirits were generally dull and heavy, and it was sent for to revive us.... I believe we all drank of the wine, and gave some to one or two of the prison guards." (John Taylor, in History of the Church, Vol. 7, page 101)

Regarding Joseph Smith removing his garments:

"Smith removed his own endowment "robe" or garment before he went to Carthage Jail and told those with him to do likewise. His nephew Joseph F. Smith later explained, "When Willard Richards was solicited [by Smith] to do the same, he declined, and it seems little less than marvelous that he was preserved without so much as a bullet piercing his garments."" (Quinn page 146) Quinn references Heber J. Grant journal sheets, 7 June 1907, LDS Archives.

Just how important is Joseph Smith to Mormonism?!!

Brigham Young stated:

"No man or woman in this dispensation will ever enter into the celestial kingdom of God without the CONSENT OF JOSEPH SMITH. ... every man and woman MUST HAVE the certificate of Joseph Smith, junior, as a passport to their entrance into the mansion where God and Christ are." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 7, p. 289)

I say that Joseph Smith was also a pedophile, child rapist and sick, perverted creep as well, since he married young girls like Helen Mar Kimball(through deceit and against their will) who was only 14, making them believe that it was just going to be a "spiritual marriage."

He of course would then shock them and force them to have "carnal intercourse" with them, in the name of the Mormon God, much to the young girl's dismay and agony, and this of course was all done behind Emma Smith's back, who was his original wife and only wife according to JosephSmith.net.

Emma knew nothing of Joseph's "God-ordained adultery" for the majority of the time and when she did find out, Joseph Smith went and "got revelation" and "Jesus Christ" told Joseph in D&C 132, that he would literally "destroy Emma", multiple times, if she didn't go along with and accept his God-ordained serial adultery, sex with virgin teens, other men's wives, etc.

Joseph Smith even married his 2 adopted daughters(EMILY AND ELIZA PARTRIDGE-pages 13 & 14), in secret from each other and Emma. In the modern day Bishop's handbook of instructions, this is called INCEST. So yes, adding to his long list of sins and disgusting vileness; Joseph Smith was also guilty of incest!!

Joseph Smith said to Helen Mar Kimball:

"If you will take this step, it will ensure your eternal salvation & exaltation and that of your father's household & all of your kindred. This promise was so great that I willingly gave myself to purchase so glorious a reward."

So, he put the eternal salvation of not only herself, but her entire family on the line, based on if she would marry him. She did not marry that SOB willingly and was manipulated through fear and threats, as you can clearly see.

Helen said:

'None but God & his angels could see my mother's bleeding heart—when Joseph asked her if she was willing, she replied "If Helen is willing I have nothing more to say." '

Helen also said:

"I would never have been sealed [married] to Joseph, had I known it was anything more than a ceremony," Helen later confided to her mother. (Mormon Enigma, pp.146-147)

That about sums it up, doesn't it?

Here is a link to Joseph Smith's child/teen-brides, a la Warren Jeffs, if you need a modern day reference to understand this.

Joseph Smith was both a polygamist and polyandrist, since Joseph Smith married at least 11 happily married women, in addition to his child-brides and other wives.

Here is a site, that shows at least 11 of his wives, and that 9 of his first 13 wives, counting Emma, were already married to other men.

But, according to most uneducated and carefully brainwashed and indoctrinated Mormons, this never happened, isn't important, or was commanded of their adultery promoting God of shame.

For those that dispute Joseph Smith's polygamy and polyandry,
here is a list of the majority of his wives, on Mormon owned, operated and run "Family Search.org."

What a legacy eh...something to be so proud of, and as current 2nd in command and next Mormon Prophet of fraud Thomas Monson says:

"May each of us emulate the Prophet Joseph's great example. He taught the truth; he lived the truth; he shared the truth. You possess a testimony; share it." (Be Thou an Example-April 2005 Mormon General Conference)

Does Joseph Smith sound like a moral man who set a great example and taught, lived and shared the truth and someone that you all want to emulate, along with your children?

I sure the hell hope not!!

Can you imagine what this world would be like if everyone ran around acting like Joseph Smith and doing all the disgusting, sick, illegal and perverted things that he did? Oh wait...that's exactly what Warren Jeffs was doing...acting just like Joseph Smith and following his "inspired teachings" to a PERFECT T.

Like I've said many times...if Joseph Smith were alive today, he'd be right where Warren Jeffs is...rotting in prison where he belongs.

Samuel the Utahnite

The Missionaries Over At Mormon.Org, Are Getting A Little Upset These Days When Confronted By The "Real Truth." Remember Guys...Slow To Anger!!

I've taken the time over the last week, to confront a couple more missionaries or volunteers, or whatever they hell they are, over at Mormon.Org. The one I just talked to, was a complete asshole and just cut me right off, when I accused him/her of lying, which they were. Here is a link to the other chat I had, in case you missed it.

Gee, wouldn't a representative of Jesus Christ be kinder and more loving and want to see why I thought they were lying and then express to me why they weren't lying, despite all of the evidence showing otherwise? I guess not!! By the way, the name of the person I was talking to was Adrian. Anyone else have a run-in with the friendly Adrian?

How much longer will this charade last(the cat's out of the bag dumb asses), as they must be getting bombarded by ex/anti-Mormons every single day. How many real people are actually going there to talk to them.

It must be the same bullshit day after day, being confronted with the shocking truth, then not answering our questions and telling us to read the Book of Mormon; because if it's true, Joseph Smith was a Prophet, the church is true and nothing we are asking them even matters, which is exactly what they tell me and everyone else that ventures in there.

Anyway, I'll post the 2 transcripts below so that you can all read them. The first one is about Dallin H. Oaks saying that they can't Ever criticize their leaders, even if the criticism is true and I then worked in Mountain Meadows Massacre and his admission that "without a doubt" Mormon leaders committed the slaughter.

The second one is about how they claim they don't condemn other religions, while openly condemning them from the First Vision forward, especially in the Book of Mormon. Adrian actually denied it again, right in the chat...OOPS!!

These guys know they are lying, when the truth is so obvious and clear; but they just think we are all idiots and will easily believe their den of lies and want to join the cult tomorrow.

Also, the Mormon Hierarchy has disabled the cut and paste option that used to be there in the chats, so now, all you have to do, is go up to File and click on Save as, and save it as a text file. You will have to do some editing, but at least we can still post our conversations with these brainwashed Mormons, for all the world to read.

Conversation #1:

Speak With a Missionary-Thank you for taking the time to chat with us and for your interest in the Church. Please know that you are welcome to worship with us any time, request a visit from Mormon missionaries, order a Book of Mormon, or continue to browse our Web site to learn more answers to life's greatest questions.

Addie: Hello! What can I do for you today?

Samuel: Yeah, I was curious to know more about the Mormon faith, after watching the PBS documentary called the Mormons.

Addie: Yes. That was an interesting program. What were some of your questions/concerns?

Samuel: Well, I was wondering if you are ever able to criticize your leaders and if you are punished when you do? They talked about all of the intellectuals that were excommunicated for speaking out and that is very troubling to me. So, are you allowed to criticize your leaders, especially the Apostles or Prophet?

Samuel: From what I've discovered, Dallin H. Oaks is one of your Prophets and he said the following:

Samuel: Sorry, go ahead and then I'll post the quote by Oaks

Samuel: Are you still there? (I'd waited like 5 minutes with no response at all and there was at least a 2 minute gap after almost every question I asked them.)

Addie: We believe that when a prophet speaks he does so by revelation and speaks the word and will of the Lord. The members of our Church sustain our leaders, which means committing to support them in their decisions. Also,

Samuel: So, they can never EVER be wrong? They are perfect and infallible? Aren't they imperfect men, just like any other man? That's what I've always believed, that no one is perfect...

Addie: in that process, they have the opportunity to voice objections and oppositions to those leaders. However, there is a difference between voicing objections and speaking against established doctrine

Addie: Prophets are not perfect.

Samuel: So, you can criticize them publicly, if you feel they are wrong or out of line, without any problems?

Addie: However, when they speak as directed by revelation, which is not everything they say, we believe it is the word of God

Samuel: If Prophets are not perfect, then anyone should be able to criticize them in my opinion, including Mormons themselves, right?

Samuel: How do you or does the world know when they are speaking by revelation or just as common men that make mistakes?

Addie: We are encouraged to pray about their words when they speak. Always, they invite us to know for ourselves and asking the Lord if what they speak is the truth. They never ask us to blindly obey.

Addie: Also, they will usually inform us of their opinions

Addie: For this reason, I personally have never found reason to criticize them

Samuel: So, let's say that they are not speaking by revelation and say something that isn't true? Can you openly criticize them for it with no fear of punishment?

Samuel: So, it's all based on what someone feels, whether it's true or not? What if you feel it's revelation and someone else doesn't?

Samuel: They don't ask you to blindly obey? But what if you pray about what they've said and you feel that it's wrong? Then what? Is that a problem?

Addie: When prophet is speaking by revelation, they make it clear that revelation is the source.

Samuel: Here's my question again; if you feel, after praying, that the Prophet or Apostles are wrong in what they are saying; can you openly criticize them for it without being punished?

Samuel: Do they allow you to speak your mind, even if it's against what they are saying? You said they aren't perfect, therefore they could screw up and make mistakes, teach false things, etc, right?

Addie: Why would you want to be part of the church if you feel that the prophets and apostles are wrong?

Samuel: Well, you earlier admitted that they aren't perfect, therefore they could be wrong. Either they are perfect and infallible or they aren't, right?

Addie: I know, from personal experience that these prophets are men of God. I trust their judgment and accept that they are not perfect. But I believe that I can trust in the counsels that God gives to them.

Samuel: I'm just trying to understand this, I really am. I have a lot of friends that are Mormon and they seem to blindly obey, saying that their leaders can never make a mistake or lead them astray in anyway and that if they try, God will literally remove them, is this true?

Addie: The most important thing that we can do is to seek

Samuel: But you still haven't answered my main question; can you criticize them, ever?

Samuel: even if they are wrong?

Addie: God's guidance through prayer to know if the prophets are acting according to the will of God.

Samuel: By admitting that they are human, they can make mistakes and can you then state openly how you feel about those human mistakes and errors, thus criticizing them?

Samuel: So, you do follow them blindly?

Samuel: Why pray to understand them or know what they are saying is true, if they can't ever teach anything wrong? It seems very redundant to me to pray about something that you already know can't possibly be wrong, ever?

Samuel: Look, here's the quote from Oaks:

Addie: Samuel I'd love to answer your questions, but it's tough to answer four at a Time.

Samuel: "It's wrong to criticize leaders of the church, even if the criticism is true."

Addie: Can I answer them one at a time?

Samuel: 4 at a time? I've been asking you the same exact question over and over, without you being willing to answer it. Again, can you openly criticize leaders of the Mormon church? I'll answer it for you, since you refuse to, and the answer is...no, because Dallin H. Oaks says you can't, even if the criticism is true and that's what troubles me greatly as an investigator and someone trying to learn more about your church.

Addie: I'm glad that you've got sincere desires to learn.

Samuel: I consider myself to be an intellectual and inquisitive person, therefore not being able to ever object to anything these imperfect men say would be hell for me and would take away my freedom of expression and thought.

Addie: One thing that Jesus taught us in Matthew Chapter 6 is that we are not to cast judment on others whether they are prophets or not. We can disagree with views that they have, but criticism is really not necessary; that is a form of judgment

Samuel: I found that comment by Oaks to be so offensive, that I about fell off of my chair. It's like he thinks that he is God or Jesus Christ and cannot ever be criticized, even it the criticism is true. Those are not the words of man who sees himself as imperfect and that's not free agency or freedom at all.

Samuel: Would you ever state Addie that no one should ever criticize you, even if the criticism is true? Do you understand why this troubles me, when earlier you admitted that they aren't perfect, yet they say that they are beyond any criticism? It seems very contradictory to me in every way.

Addie: I understand perfectly. It's alright to express your concern with those whom you are concerned with. But that issue is between you and the person you disagree with. I welcome counsel and constructive criticism, but there isn't a point in pointing out.

Addie: weakness publicly whether prophets or not.

Samuel: Also, when talking about Mountain Meadows Massacre, Dallin H. Oaks said that:

"I have no doubt, on the basis of what I have studied and learned, that Mormons, including local leaders of our church, were prime movers in that terrible episode and participated in the killing."

Samuel: So, if you disagree with the Prophet or Dallin H. Oaks for example, can you go sit down with him and discuss it in private? Do they allow any member to meet with them?

Addie: They are always welcome to letters and other forms of communication.

Samuel: So, can you publicly criticize the Prophet with "constructive criticism?"

Addie: Can I ask, what do you understand a prophet to be?

Samuel: So, let me ask you this; Dallin H. Oaks openly admits that Mormon leaders killed all of those poor people at Mountain Meadows, but you aren't allowed to criticize them for the horrible murders they committed? According to Dallin H. Oaks, even if they murder innocent men, women and children, as he has now admitted to, you CAN'T criticize them...that's insane!

Samuel: He also hopes that the Lord will forgive these murderous Mormon leaders, when I believe murder is the unforgivable and unpardonable.

Samuel: I believe a Prophet is a man of God, who speaks and acts for God

Addie: Samuel, I don't feel that you're being very sincere about listening to theanswers to your questions. Those acts of those men who committed that horrible act were not endorsed by the prophet and when he heard of their acts he was very disappointed...

Samuel: Disappointed? 120 people were slaughtered by Mormon leadership and he was disappointed? I just don't know how to overcome these major concerns, as all my friends are trying to get me to take the missionary discussions and get baptized. That's why I'm here today, to see if I can resolve these concerns with you...

Addie: with them and they were excommunicated.

Addie: The real question you need to ask is to God.

Addie: If these men speak and act for God is there reason to criticize?

Samuel: So why did Oaks say that Mormon leaders were the "prime movers" and "participated in the killings?"

Addie: He was speaking of the local leaders, not of the prophets (so like a bishop). We do not consider such men to be prophets.

Samuel: So, it's okay to publicly criticize a Bishop then? Only John D. Lee was executed or excommunicated for those crimes and there were over 100 men committing the murderers.

Addie: Do you believe that God can answer prayers?

Samuel: Okay, let me ask you this, as I've been researching this Mountain Meadows tragedy....was John D. Lee guilty of murdering these poor people or not?

Samuel:I don't believe God has to answer questions that are already answered by the facts and truth, nor do I have to ask him if they answers are already obvious and clear.

Addie: I understand your concerns, but I know that all the questions you have will be answered by a much simpler question. "Is the Book of Mormon true?"

Samuel: What?

Samuel: Mountain Meadows Massacre is discussed in the Book of Mormon?

Samuel: I had no idea...

Samuel: What part?

Addie: If the Book of Mormon is true then the church is true and so are the prophets. That act was not an act of the Church, but of misguided men, and as such really doesn't effect a person's testimony of the doctrines of the church.

Samuel: I discovered that John D. Lee was also sealed to Brigham Young too, which is strange. Back then, men sealed themselves to each other in the Mormon temple?

Addie: If you find out that the Book of MOrmon is true you will still understand that this was a horrible act that should never have taken place, but you will also know that it was not an act of God, and that the church, which tried to stop it, is of God.

Addie: I would invite you to pray and ask god of if the Book of Mormon is true with a sincere heart. Will you do that?

Samuel: So, if the Book of Mormon is true, then the Mormon church is perfect and true and has never, ever made any mistakes and their leaders are infallible and can never, ever be criticized(even if the criticism is true), and they have never made any mistakes?

Samuel: Was John D. Lee a murderer?

Addie: Samuel, will you pray with a sincere heart?

Samuel: Answer my last question please

Samuel: I'm only asking you about John D. Lee, because I don't know if you are aware or not, that in 1961, the Mormon Hierarchy fully restored his blessings and forgave him for all of those awful and tragic murders he committed, of men women, children, even babies...and that also shocks me and troubles my soul deeply. Why would they do this?

Addie: I really don't know enough about that event to give you a difinitive answer, but I do know that this church is Jesus Christ's. If you will pray with a sincere heart and faith, you will find the same.

Addie: I hope you have a great evening.

Samuel: John D. Lee was the adopted son of Brigham Young, through their sealing together in the Salt Lake City temple and he was executed for his crime of mass murder and they've now forgiven him. Why?

Samuel: Praying won't answer these questions and you never told me if Mountain Meadows is discussed in the Book of Mormon, as you seemed to indicate.

Samuel: Do you not care at all about facts or evidence?

Samuel: So, is the Mormon church the one and only true church on earth?

Addie: I care about the spirit of God. I know the Book of Mormon is true and as such, I know that the Church of Jesus Christ is the only true and living church that is guided by God himself on the earth. If you simply find that out the other questions won't...matter anymore.

Samuel: Is my church really an abomination, with false doctrines and corrupt professors, as Joseph Smith clearly indicated. You are the only people on earth that have the truth? Everyone else is guided by Satan?

Addie: Please pray. I know you'll get an answer.

Samuel: The other questions won't matter anymore? Are you serious?

Addie then cut me off and abruptly ended the conversation, refusing to answer any of my questions, insisting that the only thing that mattered, was the Book of Mormon and that "If you simply find that out that it's true, then the other questions won't matter anymore."

Now, those are the true fruits of Mormonism folks. Facts, truth, logic and reality mean nothing and all that matters is that you believe the Book of Mormon is true, end of story, if it's true, it's all true, Joseph Smith was a Prophet and the church is true, and nothing else matters.

Conversation #2:

Speak With a Missionary-Thank you for taking the time to chat with us and for your interest in the Church. Please know that you are welcome to worship with us any time, request a visit from Mormon missionaries, order a Book of Mormon, or continue to browse our Web site to learn more answers to life's greatest questions.

Referral Support: Hello, My name is Adrian how can I help you?

Mike: Hey Adrian, where are you at?

Mike: Are you an actual missionary from the MTC?

Referral Support: were are in Utah

Mike: I figured that, but are you a student, a missionary, or what? I've heard that
the folks on here are from the MTC or BYU?

Referral Support: I am a member of the Church.

Mike: Uh yeah, I figured that too...I mean what are the odds that the Mormon church would put somebody on here that wasn't even a Mormon? So, I guess you can't tell me what you are, if you're a missionary, student or whatever, which is fine.

Mike: I just wondered where I was talking to, if you were in Salt lake, Provo, etc, but obviously you aren't allowed to share that information with the public.Well, hopefully you can help me out anyway and will be more forthcoming on my other questions...

Referral Support: you are correct, I am not to share that kind of information.

Referral Support: I will do my best to answer yor questions

Mike: Sounds a little paranoid to me, since it was just a general question, but okay, hopefully they'll allow you to speak freely regarding other things.

Mike: I've always heard how secret the Mormon church is, especially regarding the temple, and I guess it's true.

Referral Support: Ok mike , I dont want to give you information about myself that is all

Mike: Anyway, I've been Catholic all my life and since moving to Utah, I've become interested in learning more about Mormons

Mike: Yeah, because I might track you down, right? LOL

Mike: whatever man

Mike: But I've read in Mormon Doctrine, which was written by one of your Apostles and also I've been reading in the book of Mormon

Referral Support: I dont want. it is simple , I am not goint to ask about your personal information.

Referral Support: ok

Mike: and it looks like you guys have really issues with Catholics or any other religion

Referral Support: we dont

Mike: Looks like we got off on a very bad foot

Mike: You don't?

Referral Support: I was catholic

Referral Support: all my family is catholic, I love them

(For some reason at this point, we were suddenly disconnected. I quickly logged back in and happened to get Adrian again and so we continued on with out conversation for a little while longer. Adrian had no idea what happened and it certainly wasn't anything I did. It must have been that Mormon God, intervening to help his servant and representative...LOL.)

Referral Support: Hi mike, I dont know what happend

Referral Support: sorry we got disconected

Mike: Yeah, me either...it just disconnected...I thought you hung up on me

Referral Support: no I didnt

Referral Support: ok , so do you have some questions

Referral Support: ?

Mike: Anyway, like I was saying, it looks to me like you guys have serious issues with Catholics or any other religion

Mike: Maybe you can help me understand somethings

Referral Support: okay

Mike: First of all, do you believe that your church is "the one and only true church" on the planet earth?

Referral Support: yes I do.

Mike: I believe the First Vision of Joseph Smith says that Jesus said, that all other churches are abominations with corrupt professors(preachers) and wrong doctrines, or something like that...

Referral Support: they are not guided by God.

Mike: So, if you have "the one and only truth", what does that say about my religion and the religions of most of my friends and family? Why do we have to become Mormon?

Mike: So, you are telling me that my religion is not guided by God? By what authority do you tell me this?

Mike: You realize that's offensive, right?

Referral Support: well, that is what I believe (No apologies of course)

Referral Support: dont take offence on that

Mike: It's funny how Mormons and your leaders always say that they never cut down any other religion...but you clearly do, by saying that you have the only truth on earth and that all the rest are abominations, corrupt and wrong.

Mike: Yeah, but your church believes that everyone needs to be a Mormon, in this life or the next, right? That's why you baptize dead people.

Mike: So, if Mormonism is "the one and only true church" on earth, then all the other religions are indeed false, right?

Referral Support: We are the only true Church, I know that. we have prophets and apostles that recieve revelation from God. All other Churches are full of great people, great feelings and amazing teachings , but lack authority to act in God's name

Mike: Do you believe that Satan runs my church and that it's of the Devil?

Mike: You believe this why? (This was an answer to their last comment)

Referral Support: no, I dont think so.

Mike: Aren't you just making the same claim that most religions make?

Referral Support: well you tell me what do you believe?

Mike: You believe in the Book of Mormon, right? Joseph said it's the most correct book on earth or something like that didn't he?

Referral Support: what do you believe about the LDS church and your church?

Mike: I don't believe that you have to belong to one particular church in order to be saved...I believe it's based on the kind of person you are and how you treat others, not whose church you call home.
Referral Support: well you said you were catholic, and that is not what they believe

Mike: Well, we are talking about what you believe and preach, not what I believe and in the Catholic church, we don't go around openly condemning other churches, calling them the church of the devil and abominations, whores of all the earth and Mothers of Harlots and we try to be kind to everyone.

Referral Support: but what is your doctrine?

Mike: So, you tell me what my doctrine is, since you are so well informed about it

Referral Support: you certanly believe exactly what you are criticizing from the LDS church

Mike: That unless you are a Catholic, you're screwed? That's what I believe?

Referral Support: the catholic Church to be the only true church.

Mike: Well, at least we don't preach that Mormons and all other churches are the church of Satan and the whore of all the earth

Referral Support: we dont prach about anybody else, We actually dont preach about others at all. (Can you believe that shit? I can't believe they actually said this? Now tell me that they didn't know they were outright lying when they made this statement!!)

Mike: Still there?(There was a very long pause before their last comment and this comment of mine, as they both popped up at the same time.) You believe in the Book of Mormon, don't you? Well, it greatly insults me and any other religion out there, yet your church claims that we are all evil

Mike: Saying you don't preach about other religions is an outright lie and you know it

Referral Support: Mike , is not a lie, and please remember what your religion claims before you criticize the LDS church for what it claims

1 Nephi 14:10.....Behold there are save two churches only, one is the church of the lamb of God and the other is the church of the DEVIL, wherefore, whoso belongeth not to the church of the Lamb of God belongeth to that great church, which is the MOTHER OF ABOMINATIONS; and she is the WHORE of all the earth.

1 Nephi 13:34...wherefore, after I have visited them in judgment, and smitten them by the hand of the Gentiles, and after the Gentiles do stumble exceedingly, because of the most plain and precious parts of the gospel of the Lamb which have been kept back by that ABOMINABLE church, which is the MOTHER OF HARLOTS, saith the Lamb--I will be merciful unto the Gentiles in that day, insomuch that I will bring forth unto them, in mine own power, much of my gospel, which shall be plain and precious, saith the Lamb.

Referral Support: Take care

Mike: Where are you going?!! I wasn't done...

==========

That was the abrupt end of the chat. I guess they can't handle "the real truth", can they? Hypocritical jackasses!!

I look forward to everyone's comments on these chats.

Samuel the Utahnite

"I have no doubt, (based on)what I have studied..that Mormons, including local leaders of our church, were prime movers/participated in the killing."

MP3 File

This is the audio clip of Dallin H. Oaks, from "The Mormons", declaring:

"I have no doubt, on the basis of what I have studied and learned, that Mormons, including local leaders of our church, were prime movers in that terrible episode and participated in the killing."

He then also says:

“I pray that he(The Lord) can find a way to forgive those who took such a terrible action against their fellow beings.”

In reality, the Church has already completely forgiven John D. Lee, the only man ever held accountable, who was executed for the crime, while over 100 other men were never held accountable by Brigham Young or anyone else, due to their “vow of silence”, which would result in death if broken.

In 1961, the Mormon First Presidency reinstated all of John D. Lee's blessings, including his temple blessings, meaning that they, the Mormon Hierarchy and Prophet, have indeed completely forgiven John D. Lee, as if he did nothing at all and his sins are now white as snow.

"For more than a hundred years, the families of John D. Lee have borne the opprobrium of the massacre alone. For that reason, they have welcomed every effort to probe the question; certainly no truth could be worse than the stories to which they were subjected. Now they have special cause to rejoice, for on April 20, 1961, the First Presidency and the Council of Twelve Apostles of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints met in joint council, and: 'It was the action of the Council after considering all the facts available that authorization be given for the reinstatement to membership and former blessings [temple marriages] to John D. Lee.' Word of this was sent out to members of the family, and on May 8 and 9, the necessary ordinances were performed in the Salt Lake Temple. A complete record is in the files of the Latter-day Saints Genealogical Society." (Mountain Meadows Massacre, p. 223)

It's hard to understand this reinstating of John D. Lee's complete blessings, when Joseph Smith and Mormon doctrine clearly teaches that Murder is unforgivable, let alone MASS MURDER. Gee, I wonder how they explain this?

I beg all TBMS and Mormon Apologists, to enlighten all of us evil ex-Mormons, as to how this can be. Doesn't this contradict your beloved Joseph Smith and his teachings?

Joseph Smith supposedly received the following revelation from Jesus Christ:

SECTION 132

27 The blasphemy against the Holy Ghost, which shall not be forgiven in the world nor out of the world, is in that ye commit murder wherein ye shed innocent blood, and assent unto my death, after ye have received my new and everlasting covenant, saith the Lord God; and he that abideth not this law can in nowise enter into my glory, but shall be damned, saith the Lord.

To further support what was recorded in the D&C, Joseph Smith also clearly taught that murderers cannot have eternal life, cannot be saved, cannot be baptized for the remission of sins and that they will all literally go to hell, which must be outer darkness, since hell is not a Mormon glory.

Joseph Smith said:

“A murderer for instance, one that sheds innocent blood, cannot have forgiveness.” (Teachings Of The Prophet Joseph Smith-Page 339)

I also hope that since, Dallin H. Oaks and the Mormon Hierarchy, have now finally admitted that “Mormons, including local leaders of our church, were prime movers in that terrible episode and participated in the killing”, that this will free up the families of those who were brutally executed that day at Mountain Meadows, to finally be able to file a class action lawsuit against the Mormon church and the current Hierarchy.

This statement by Dallin H. Oaks, admitting fault, also contradicts Hinckley, who said the following on Sept 11, 1999:

"No one can explain what happened in these meadows 142 years ago. We may speculate, but we do not know. We do not understand it. We cannot comprehend it. We can only say that the past is long since gone."

and

"That which we have done here must never be construed as an acknowledgment of the part of the church of any complicity in the occurrences of that fateful day."



It looks like Hinckley, the current Mormon Prophet and Dallin H. Oaks, current Mormon Apostle, need to have a private meeting and discuss the descrpencies that exist their public statements.

Also, based on the other comment by Dallin H. Oaks, which I just posted the other day, clearly stating that, “It's wrong to criticize leaders of the church, even if the criticism is true”, this means that even though he has now admitted that church leaders "were prime movers in that terrible episode and participated in the killing” of around 120 innocent men, women and children; you cannot criticize them for it and in fact, he probably wants you to follow his lead and pray that they will all be forgiven, just like they’ve forgiven John D. Lee.

Samuel the Utahnite

Dallin H. Oaks-Mormon Apostle/Cult Leader, Arrogantly Says: "It's Wrong To Criticize Leaders Of The (Mormon)Church, Even If The Criticism Is True."

MP3 File

Above is both the video and audio clip of Dallin H. Oaks, current Mormon Apostle/cult leader, from the PBS documentary, "The Mormons", declaring unequivocally:

"IT'S WRONG TO CRITICIZE LEADERS OF THE (MORMON)CHURCH, EVEN IF THE CRITICISM IS TRUE."

This statement is truly the epitome of arrogance and unbelievable!! If this doesn't prove that Mormonism is a totalitarian regime/cult, then I don't know what does.

Why would anyone want to be under a literal Mormon dictatorship of normal, everyday men, that are masquerading as Prophets, Seers and Revelators of God; while they are robbing you blind of your money and freedom of thought, expression and opinion. Wake up folks and see the light!!

If this doesn't bother you Mormon true-believers and followers out there, then nothing ever will!!

I mean hell, "even if the criticism is true", you can't say anything? Is he serious?!! That doesn't remind any of you true-believers of a communist country or the Nazis, does it? Isn't that how they ran things?

Gee, and here I thought that the Mormons taught everyone that we fought a war in heaven, so that we could have our free agency here on earth? FREE AGENCY? That doesn't exist in Mormonism and Mr. Oaks just proved it, for all the world to hear. I guess everyone is FREE to OBEY THEM OR ELSE, right?

I will also be doing a follow-up podcast(on my Mormon Truth Uncensored Podcast), regarding this statement alone and what exactly it means in the big scheme of things and how it stands alone in showing the world that Mormonism is absolutely a fraud and a cult, a la Jim Jones, Heaven's Gate, The Moonies, David Koresh's Branch Davidians, etc.

Of course, the Mormon Hierarchy is a bit smarter then those guys were, since they don't want to command everyone to drink the poisoned punch, because then they wouldn't be getting anymore tithing, fast offerings and the other vast array of donations, that they beg and plead for every single day.

If they ordered a mass suicide, where would they get the easy billions that are rolling in, to buy their next malls or re-design downtowns or build luxury resorts or buy cattle ranches and gaming preserves, or to purchase 663 acres(adding to their already 6,000 that they own) in Laie, Hawaii, to build a 550 home housing development, right? What would the corporation of the President or corporation of the Presiding Bishopric do without all those easy billions?

But I just wanted this quote and several other quotes, to be stand alone downloads, so that everyone can download the exact quotes and then pass them around to the world, and their Mormon friends and family, without any additional commentary by me.

I will also be posting many other quotes for everyone to download and have, to hopefully help family and friends that are brainwashed and still stuck in the Mormon cult, to see the light and escape. The audio of this particular quote, will also be posted on my main Mormon Truth blog for everyone to listen to, download and link to.

Remember everyone, that the truth shall truly set you free, from cult leaders like Thomas S. Monson, Dallin H. Oaks, Boyd K. Packer, Gordon B. Hinckley and many others, both current and future, who will punish you for criticizing them, "even if the criticism is true"; because they are infallible and claim that their Mormon God will literally, physically remove them, if they ever try to lead you astray, therefore, they can do no wrong, EVER, and basically consider themselves to be Gods on earth, who answer to NO ONE.

My advice folks....GET OUT NOW!!

Samuel the Utahnite

Yet Another Mormon Missionary Sadly Dies, This Time In Washington State. Do Mormon Garments Really Protect Anyone As The Mormon Hierarchy Claims?!!

Mormon Missionary Killed In Washington
Uploaded by SamueltheUtahnite

(***I'd like to thank whomever the person is that flagged this video "for mature audiences only." I know the subject matter might be difficult for some people(especially TBMS or Mormon apologists or Mormon leaders in denial) to deal with, but this video came straight off of the local 10 o'clock news here in Utah and should not be labeled "for mature audiences only." I agree that this story is tragic and horrific, but it is a fact that this young man died as a supposed servant of Jesus Christ and was not protected by his Jesus, Jesus' supposed Prophet/Apostles or his garments, which the Mormon Hierarchy promise will protect him. What happened to that spirit of discernment, AGAIN, that they're supposed to have and brag about on a regular basis? This is a story that everyone needs to see, especially future missionaries and their families.***)
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William T. Anguilau Jr. was serving in the Seattle, Washington mission when he was tragically killed last week after being hit while riding his bike. His Stake President wanted to go before the news cameras, to make sure that everyone knows that the family is just fine with everything and that they accepted it as a "simply an extension of his mission on the other side" and that his family "doesn't have any ill will with either the person that hit him or the church."

The last part about the family not being upset with the church, is the most important part of course, for the church and especially their cult leader Gordon B. Hinckley and all the future Mormon missionaries. Bottom line is that everything is just fine, the works going forward, no worries people, IT'S ALL GOOD!!

Remember everyone, that the OFFICIAL position of the Mormon Hierarchy, as taught and stated by the Mormon Apostle M. Russell Ballard(a direct and very proud blood descendant of Joseph Smith) is that it doesn't matter if Mormon missionaries get HURT or KILLED in the future, IT WILL NOT STOP THIS WORK!! The work and the cult will always, ALWAYS trump human life, according to these evil BASTARDS sitting in their ivory tower of shame at 50 East North Temple, in Salt Lake City, Utah.

The Mormon Hierarchy lives the life of Kings, while missionaries suffer tremendous hardship and even give their lives for these ASSHOLES. They fail to teach the missionaries any safety tips and have them so scared to get their numbers and baptize, that they probably do things that they wouldn't normally do and go to places they would never normally go to and they end up making pressured and sometimes irrational decisions that they normally wouldn't make.

They are forced to ride bikes in cities crowded with cars and on busy roads, where bikes have no business even being. Does the Mormon Hierarchy spend time teaching auto safety in the MTC or what to do if they come across a robbery or murderer, or someone with a gun? Of course they don't, because they don't give a shit about any of them.

Was William T. Anguilau Jr. or any other missionary given a special course in the MTC on bike safety? I doubt it, as they were too busy teaching the missionaries all of their bold faced lies and fairy tales and how to manipulate people into their cult corporation and also, because nobody in the great and spacious building gives a rat's ass if missionaries are hurt or killed, as plainly stated by M. Russell Ballard.

Bottom line is that the safety of missionaries doesn't even cross the minds of the Mormon Hierarchy and it never has and never will, fully supported by M. Russell Ballard, the head asshole of the missionary department.

In this video, The Stake President Tracy Branch, says that William now has a "free ticket so to speak and WE'RE GLAD OF THAT....and that he returned with honor." So even though there is no way normally, to spin a tragic death into something wonderful, positive and faith promoting for future Mormon cult missionaries and their families, they've tried to do it once again, especially mentioning his "free ticket" to Paradise. Who wouldn't want a "free ticket", right?

Damn, it kind of sounds like a teaching of some famous cult leaders like Jim Jones, David Koresh or what was taught in the Heaven's Gate cult, doesn't it? Isn't this what organized religion is really all about though? Doesn't everyone want that "free ticket so to speak?"

How repulsive and sad, to hear the pathetic Stake President Tracy Branch spewing the same old typical bullshit, that the Mormon leadership spews after missionaries are tragically killed. It's always a "cover your ass as quickly as possible routine", the second a Mormon missionary is tragically killed, injured, attacked, etc.

I mean after all, this Stake President gets some camera time and if he handles it well enough and defends the Goddamn cult, he might get a promotion in the cult corporation, right? I'm sure he received the congratulatory phone call from Hinckley or one of his cronies, commending him and how well he handled the situation and I'm sure good things now await the heartless scumbag.

I wish the best for William T. Anguilau Jr's family, who is just perfectly fine and have no issue whatsoever with William's death and understand it to simply be an "extension of his mission", according to their loving, caring and understanding Stake President/cult leader Tracy Branch, who would always put the family first and the cult second, right? Apparently not!!

Of course with yet another death of a Mormon missionary, which brings the total to at least 9(that we've heard of-which doesn't include robberies, car jackings, rapes, beatings, etc) in around 16 months time, it brings several issues to mind.

The other day I was reading on RFM and a poster that I highly respect named Cheryl(I think this is the same Cheryl that Steve Benson was allowed(by Susan I/S) to ridicule and openly attack, right after she announced her daughter had just been sent to the hospital) was getting a lot of grief from people that felt no one should ever mention that fact that Mormon garments don't protect missionaries or anyone else. They said that she was mocking the missionaries and making fun of them...WTF?!!

They felt that she was out of line, insensitive and many other colorful adjectives. She couldn't figure out why everyone was so pissed off and attacking her, since she was trying to save future lives and point out the truth, which is that garments protect no one, EVER and never have and that everyone needed to know the "real truth."

So, after reading her comments and those of others, I was pretty pissed off and I decided to respond and this is what I had to say about the subject:

I'm with you and support you Cheryl 100%! Thank you for this post.

The Mormon Hierarchy teaches that Mormon garments will protect you, which is a damn lie.

How many of us ex-Mormons heard the FPRs growing up about Mormon garments? J. Willard Marriott even shared his personal experience and testimony, in the 60 minute interview about his boat catching on fire, and how nothing that was covered by his garments got burned, etc. He flat out stated that garments protect you from harm and he's currently serving as an Area Authority Seventy back in the Virginia area, as a member of the third Quorum of the Seventy.

Did the Mormon Hierarchy issue a correction on their former "mistakes in the media" page, stating that J. Willard Marriott's FPR wasn't true? Of course not, because they want people to believe their cult bullshit and FPRs. Isn't it more offensive to say that he was protected by garments, while many others aren't? What does this say? Does the Mormon God only protect the elite and rich Mormons? Is he just more worthy than the rest of the "regular Mormons?"

Was it that those that died weren't worthy? It's like Benjamin Ellsworth's mission president mentioning, right after he died, that he'd just met with him a day or 2 before and that "he was worthy." Why did he have to point that out? What did that have to do with anything? Apparently then, worthiness has nothing to do with garments protecting you? Gee, I thought it did?

Even Hinckley says you won’t get sick on your mission and cause the work to “grind to a halt”, if you are “obedient” to all the rules. Wouldn’t this include death? So I guess the opposite is also true, meaning that any missionary that dies, is considered unworthy by the Mormon Hierarchy, right? Now that’s offensive!

So, when missionaries are crushed by trains, like Benjamin Ellsworth was, or burned to death in a car crash, like the two over in New Zealand, or hit by a car and killed or like Morgan Young, who was shot and killed working in an unsafe area full of regular gunfire(as his companion said to a newspaper here in Utah), I think it is our duty, as ex-Mormons that know the truth, to point out that GARMENTS DON'T PROTECT ANYONE and many other things.

In fact, I think it is irresponsible not to point this out and by pointing it out, we can actually help to save lives, like Cheryl pointed out. We can also point out that missionaries are not being led by Jesus Christ or "inspired men of God" and that's why they are working in unsafe areas, towns and countries, every single day. Is that offensive too? What is okay to talk about?

I can't believe that so many ex-Mormons are so afraid or timid to point out the truth and facts, no matter what the situation is. Do we want to help others or not? By pointing out the fact that missionaries dying, is a glaring example of how garments don't protect anyone and is another example of the Mormon Hierarchy lying, and is very necessary and not being cold, mean or mocking in my opinion.

I mean hell, if anyone should be protected, it should be Jesus' personal servants on earth, the missionaries, shouldn't it? Maybe they were masturbating and not worthy of the protection of the garments? It's ridiculous!

Isn't the myth that garments will protect you (which the Mormon Hierarchy teaches and allows to be perpetuated by their General Authorities in national TV interviews), far worse than us ex-Mormons pointing out that they are lying AGAIN and that garments don't protect anyone?

Isn't it the Mormon Hierarchy that is openly mocking the dead missionaries and their families and then using them for PR, like when Ballard says, "In many ways, Elder Young has been transferred" and "that he continues to preach his message in another sphere."

By pointing out that garments are useless and don't protect anyone, we aren't "mocking" the dead missionary, rather just telling it like it is, exposing the Mormon cult and hopefully helping others in the process, to turn on their brain and realize the garment myth is complete bullshit and hopefully we are helping to prevent future deaths, like Cheryl is pointing out. Is this concept too deep for some of you?

Morgan Young's mom said "I'm proud that he died with his boots on." In other words, they are very strong and devout in the church, have 2 more kids getting ready for missions(they are more determined than ever now to go and say that they now have a legacy to fulfill left by Morgan) and nothing would ever affect their testimony. If the death of their son didn't phase them, nothing ever will.

They had their photo op with Hinckley and Ballard, the day of the funeral, who used Morgan's death as a PR stunt and assured everyone that "missions were the safest place for a 19-21 year old to be." Yeah, nice, loving words AT A FUNERAL of a missionary that was just KILLED.....I guess they were just taking the Boyd KKK Packer approach toward funerals?

Why are ex-Mormons pissed about people pointing out that garments didn't protect these missionaries, when it's THE TRUTH? Is that heartless and mocking the dead missionaries? Really? Are you guys serious? I guess there isn't ever a time to talk about it then, is there? I guess we all need to live in fear and utter trepidation of discussing such a touchy subject or offending "the Mormons?” Our attack is clearly on the Mormon Hierarchy, not the missionaries, so figure it out people and get a clue.

I guess it's kind of like how the Mormon Hierarchy call us apostates "evil, "disease germs", "full of darkness", "dangerous", that "they should run from us as fast as they can", "anti-Christs", etc? Yeah, I guess we need to be nice and loving to these folks, right?

Now, if us ex-Mormons want to get pissed about something and re-direct our anger to the proper place, we should all be focused on what the asshole Mormon Apostle Ballard had to say, in January of 2006, right after 5 missionaries had been tragically killed in about a month's time.

Ballard said:

"This work will continue to go forward regardless of what happens, regardless of what the future may hold. If there are other missionaries that are HURT or other missionaries that are KILLED, IT WILL NOT STOP THIS WORK. Joseph Smith made that abundantly clear that there would be nothing that would stop this work from rolling forward till the Great Jehovah comes forward and says the work is done. And He hasn't said that yet."

Ballard Not Caring If Missionaries Die!!
Uploaded by SamueltheUtahnite

Now, I don't know about you guys, but I find these words, by a Mormon Apostle, to be far worse and mocking than somebody pointing out that garments don't protect missionaries or anyone else. Where's the outrage and anger by ex-Mormons regarding this statement, by somebody official, high up in the Mormon church hierarchy? Ballard is the Mormon Hierarchy's guru and go to man on missionaries and directly blood related to Joseph Smith for Mormon God's sake! Shouldn’t his words outrage those that are so upset about garments being discussed? What hypocrites!!

Ballard, at that same time, also said this regarding missionaries:

"When you say, What kind of work do we do to see that the missionaries are kept in safe places and that they proselyte in safe places? We do the very, very best we know how, UNDER THE SUPERVISION OF INSPIRED, CALLED, WONDERFUL MISSION PRESIDENTS AND THEIR WIVES."

This is another outrageous lie! "Safe places" my ass! Is that why they send sisters to South Africa, to walk the streets alone, when it is the rape Capital of the world and has one of the highest crime rates in the world? Over a million women are raped there every damn year! Oh, am I being too offensive in pointing out these truths and facts?

The US Government's website warns against all Americans traveling there, specifically to that area where they were attacked and how many of the companies over there are pulling out all of the their workers, especially Americans, due to the dangers and crime and kidnappings? Missionaries(according to those who have been there) get robbed and car jacked there every single month(it is completely unreported to the media and covered up by the Mormon Hierarchy)....does anyone care in the Mormon Hierarchy? Of course they don't. THEY DON'T GIVE A SHIT!

Here are some quick stats on South Africa, according to the UN:

#2 in the world for assault and murder.

Average of 170 South African Police officers killed every year.

In 1996, it was reported that they had 50,481 rapes reported, with it being likely that only 1 in 20 were being reported, which comes out to over 1 million rapes a year, as I stated above.

Danny Brock, the mission President, right after these 2 sisters were brutally beaten, robbed and then gang raped for hours at gunpoint and one was shot, said:

"Now, they're getting the best care money can buy. When this is over, THEY PLAN TO REMAIN IN SOUTH AFRICA AND COMPLETE THEIR MISSIONARY WORK."

What heart, what compassion and what a great man! Of course, the cult always comes first, doesn't it, even after being brutally raped for hours and shot? Holy shit! Now this is something to get pissed about folks and fellow ex-Mormons. Oh yeah, did their garments protect them? Of course not and that's a fact and the truth, as painful as it may be for some of you to deal with and understand.

When interviewed, Molly Jolley of Bountiful, Utah, the daughter of the MP Danny Brock, reiterated what the asshole Ballard said:

"Bad things happen everywhere and it's unfortunate. My heart goes out to those poor sisters and their families BUT THE WORK MUST GO ON."

FUCK THE WORK, WE ARE TALKING ABOUT HUMAN LIFE HERE MOLLY!

Molly Jolley Says: "The Work Must Go On"
Uploaded by SamueltheUtahnite

Now, that's something to get pissed about folks, if you are just a normal human being, that puts human life and the well being of others above a damn cult, which Molly obviously doesn't. She is a brainwashed cult member that puts the Goddamn cult above EVERYTHING else, even life itself, as does her daddy Brock, the disgraceful mission president.

Hinckley, regarding missionaries has said:

"No one else in the Church has a farewell when entering a particular service. We never have a special farewell-type meeting for a newly called bishop, for a stake president, for a Relief Society president, for a General Authority, or anyone else of whom I can think. WHY SHOULD WE HAVE MISSIONARY FAREWELLS?"

He then ended with this:

"We know this will be a great disappointment to many families. Mothers and fathers, brothers and sisters, and friends have participated in the past. We ask that you accept this decision. Where a farewell has already been arranged, it may go forward. But none in the traditional sense should be planned for the future. We are convinced that when all aspects of the situation are considered, THIS IS A WISE DECISION. Please accept it, my dear brethren. I extend this plea also to the sisters, particularly the mothers.

We hope also that holding elaborate open houses after the sacrament meeting at which the missionary speaks will not prevail. Members of the family may wish to get together. We have no objection to this. However, WE ASK THAT THERE BE NO PUBLIC RECEPTION TO WHICH LARGE NUMBERS ARE INVITED.

Missionary service is such a wonderful experience that it brings with it its own generous reward. And WHEN A MISSIONARY RETURNS TO HIS FAMILY AND HIS WARD, HE MAY AGAIN BE GIVEN OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK IN A SACRAMENT MEETING."

Yeah Hinckley, WHAT IF THEY ARE DEAD AND NEVER DO RETURN ALIVE...DID YOU EVER CONSIDER THAT DUMBASS IN YOUR EQUATION AND SUPPOSED PRAYING TO GOD?!

I guess Hinckley also isn't including his "ELABORATE birthday bashes" that he has every 5 years, on the tithe payers money, when he says, "We hope also that holding elaborate open houses after the sacrament meeting at which the missionary speaks will not prevail" and "WE ASK THAT THERE BE NO PUBLIC RECEPTION TO WHICH LARGE NUMBERS ARE INVITED." DAMN HYPOCRITE! This is the bullshit that should piss off ex-Mormons.

I guess Hinckley also wasn't including his own pathetic ass and his public birthday bashes(in the $500 million Gordydome) with Donny Osmond, Mike Wallace, Gladys Knight, the 5 Browns, etc, when he said, "We never have a special farewell-type meeting for a newly called bishop, for a stake president, for a Relief Society president, for a General Authority, or anyone else of whom I can think. Why should we have missionary farewells?"

Oh, he isn't a General Authority? Again, I point all of this out, because this is what should piss us off and outrage us, not whether we(ex-Mormons) are discussing Mormon magic underwear and whether it protected someone that was just killed or not. I find it more offensive NOT TO TALK ABOUT IT.

Why is the truth so hard for some people to talk about? We aren't in the Mormon cult anymore guys and we can freely talk about whatever we want to now...get over the mind control and need to feel so sheepish and afraid of offending someone, when you are simply presenting the facts and truth.

We need to take every opportunity we can to point out the lies and fraud of Mormonism, in the hopes of helping someone. I don't give a damn if I offend 13,000,000 Mormons, or all ex-Mormons, or everyone in RFM, in order to help someone else see the light or not die and I wish that more of us ex-Mormons had this attitude, I really do.

Let's be honest, the Mormon Hierarchy's teachings on garments are used as a control tactic, a fear tactic and to make a shit load of money, in the hundreds of millions of dollars. They are the bad guys and the assholes, that perpetuate this bullshit, not us ex-Mormons who talk about it.

Unfortunately, their desire for power, control and filthy lucre, is costing the lives of the innocent people and MISSIONARIES we speak of, that buy their bullshit fairy tale and FPRs, which claim garments will protect you. This is outrageous and tragic and verging on criminal.

Now, any ex-Mormons out there, that want to get pissed off at other ex-Mormons for talking about this openly and freely, whenever they want, and that are not pissed off at the Mormon Hierarchy, need to re-direct their anger and frustration to the correct place, which is the Mormon Hierarchy and get a clue while your at it.

The very fact is that WE(those who are talking about garments, etc) are the ones that actually care tremendously about human life, and that’s why we are trying to point out that the Mormon Hierarchy doesn’t give a shit about human life or who dies or if missionaries get killed, repeating again what M. Russell Ballard said plainly, right after 5 missionaries had been tragically killed, “If there are other missionaries that are HURT or other missionaries that are KILLED, IT WILL NOT STOP THIS WORK.”

He’s the guy you want to go after, he's the cold, callous asshole, not other ex-Mormons that are trying to expose him and his damn cult.

It's guys like Ballard and Hinckley and all the other cronies in the Mormon Hierarchy(going back to horny Joe himself), that knowingly perpetuate their fraud to the world and the teachings like "garments will protect you from harm" and the reason that these missionaries, along with their families are brainwashed, believe they are called of Jesus Christ, have leaders directly led by Jesus Christ and are then subsequently killed on their mission representing the Mormon cult.

If the lies and fraud didn't exist and they weren't brainwashed, they wouldn't have been killed on their missions, plain and simple.

So, how does pointing these facts and truths out, make us not concerned about human life? Has anyone really stopped to think that we do what we do, because we care SO MUCH about human life and we are trying to prevent future tragedies? It’s because “they are and were someone's children, friends, grandchildren, and loved ones” that we do what we do, or at least why I do what I do.

I also added another comment to another post, regarding this issue and specifically, the 2 sisters that were brutally raped in South Africa:

Yeah, according to Molly Jolley, the lovely daughter of Danny Brock, the Mission President in South Africa, gang rapes out on a public street, could happen anywhere, even Bountiful, Utah, where Molly lives.

I'd like someone to please tell me the last time 2 women were robbed, beaten and then gang raped at gunpoint for hours, with one being shot, in broad daylight, right on a main street in Bountiful, like 5th south or 5th west? Yeah, Bountiful is just like South Africa, dumbass!

Molly ended her interview saying:

"Bad things happen everywhere and it's unfortunate. My heart goes out to those poor sisters and their families but THE WORK MUST GO ON."

NICE MOLLY! What love, compassion and understanding....but yeah, the cult must go on.

Her Daddy Danny Brock, right after the brutal attack on the 2 sisters, said:

"They were walking alongside a busy road (the old Harding highway), which they knew well. Moreover, it was one of the busiest times of the day with cars whizzing past. Safer than that, you would not get."

Yeah, apparently not safe enough asshole! Oh by the way, an estimated 1,000,000 plus women a year are raped in South Africa and it is ranked 2nd in the world in murder rate...ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY OF THAT DANNY BOY OR DO YOU JUST NOT GIVE A FLYING SHIT?! NOTHING IS TOO GOOD FOR YOUR MORMON GOD AND JESUS, RIGHT MR. BROCK?! IN FACT, IT WOULD BE AN HONOR TO BE RAPED AND MURDERED FOR THE MORMON GOD, WOULDN'T IT?

Spencer W. Kimball would certainly agree, and in fact, these two sisters should be ashamed to even be alive at all, because they should have died, fighting off their rapists harder, as Kimball teaches in MOF. Oh yeah and I certainly hope that they didn't "contribute to the foul dead" as Kimball also hopes.

Danny Brock also said:

"Now, they're getting the best care money can buy. When this is over, THEY PLAN TO REMAIN IN SOUTH AFRICA AND COMPLETE THEIR MISSIONARY WORK."

When this is over? When will that be? Oh yeah, being robbed, beaten and gang raped for hours at gun point, with one of them being shot, was just no big deal man and as soon as they heal PHYSICALLY, they'll return to their mission.

Danny Brock is the asshole of the century! Do these cult leaders ever stop for one second to consider the human element of the situation? EVER?!

I can't even imagine the mental, psychological and emotional trauma that these 2 sisters went through and here their President is, covering the Morg's ass at all costs, making sure everyone knows that the sisters are just fine and can't wait to get back on their mission for the Mormon cult and Jesus.

Will the Mormon cult pay their lifelong medical and counseling bills if they need it? Yeah right! Did they stay on their missions? Anyone know? I'm sure they put tremendous pressure on them to do so, as they always do.

Yeah, here's the Mormon cult faith promoting version of what happened, or how they would report it, or what they would want everyone to think was written in the sister's journal entry for that day, in a nutshell:

"Today we went tracting, were walking down a busy street, and we were robbed, beaten, gang raped for hours at gun and knife point and I was also shot. I was so upset, because we had a 3:00 appointment that we weren't able to make...I hope they understand and that we can reschedule.

Anyway, now we are in the hospital, getting the best care money can buy and I can't wait to get back on that same street again, in the rape Capital of the world, where I know that Jesus Christ and my garments will protect me next time, since I'm a representative of Jesus Christ himself and the 'one and only true church on earth.'

I just hope we can get out of the hospital by Thursday, because we have an appointment for the 3rd discussion with a family that is about to get baptized. I'm so blessed to be here and I know that what we experienced will just make us stronger, was meant to be and that lots of good will come from it."

Sick, demented, disgraceful cult of shit! Talk about a complete MIND FUCK!
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I think my comments clearly explain how I feel and I'm sure the TBM apologists will have plenty to say, or then again, maybe not. Maybe they'll be too embarrassed? I highly doubt it, as they'll usually defend the Mormon cult at any cost, literally.

I mean hey, if they can defend racism, blood atonement and sex with kids and other men's wives, in the name of their God, by their "Praise to the Man/Greater than Jesus Christ Prophet Joseph Smith", why not defend this, right? This is something minor to them, I'm sure, in the big scheme of the cult.

I look forward to your comments,

Samuel the Utahnite