Tuesday, August 23, 2005

My opinion on Boyd K Packer, his exact words regarding funerals, whitewashing and respecting each other as we each recover!!

***Update-I know that many of you have found this talk when looking up David A. Bednar, because I mention him and his ridiculous talk on earrings, in this post. Here is the link to the complete post that I wrote specifically about that talk, with the links, for both the text and the audio, so that you can listen to and read it for yourself.***

I just wanted to take the opportunity to reprint exactly what Boyd K. Packer said about funerals. This thread was inspired by the "A Mormon Funeral" thread by Moroni's pizza but something that I have been pondering for months. I was finding my way out of the "Mormon cult" when I first discovered it and read it and it deeply offended me. I had just lost a loved one, had to do battle with a Bishop over every detail of the funeral and then to read these words, well, there aren't words to describe what I felt and thought about this piece of garbage, Boyd K. Packer. Now I understood where my Bishop had been coming from. I researched it this morning, and isn't it amazing that this talk no longer exists on the Churches speeches website. It is gone!!

Just another modern day "whitewash" of Mormon History. But I have included a link to an official Church site where it mentions the talk in a course of religion that was taught by none other than David A Bednar, TEACHINGS OF THE LIVING PROPHETS Religion 333, Fall 2004, I'm assuming at BYU Idaho, since he was the Pres. According to the Official public Mormon Church, this talk now does not exist. But it was required reading, this talk, during week 4 of the course in 2004:

"The Unwritten Order of Things," a devotional address delivered at Brigham Young University on 15 October 1996. (reserve)


Here are Boyd K. Packer's exact words regarding funerals how they should be handled and what their "real" purpose is:

Another point of order: Bishops should not yield the arrangement of meetings to members. They should not yield the arrangement for funerals or missionary farewells to families. It is not the proper order of things for members or families to expect to decide who will speak and for how long. Suggestions are in order, of course, but the bishop should not turn the meeting over to them. We are worried about the drift that is occurring in our meetings.

Funerals could and should be the most spiritually impressive. They are becoming informal family reunions in front of ward members. Often the Spirit is repulsed by humorous experiences or jokes when the time could be devoted to teaching the things of the Spirit, even the sacred things.

When the family insists that several family members speak in a funeral, we hear about the deceased instead of about the Atonement, the Resurrection, and the comforting promises revealed in the scriptures. Now it's all right to have a family member speak at a funeral, but if they do, their remarks should be in keeping with the spirit of the meeting.

I have told my Brethren in that day when my funeral is held, if any of them who speak talk about me, I will raise up and correct them. The gospel is to be preached. I know of no meeting where the congregation is in a better state of readiness to receive revelation and inspiration from a speaker than they are at a funeral. This privilege is being taken away from us because we don't understand the order of things--the unwritten order of things--that relates to the administration of the Church and the reception of the Spirit.

Our bishops should not give our meetings away. That is true of our missionary farewells. We're deeply worried that they now have become kind of reunions in front of ward members. The depth of spiritual training and teaching which could go on is being lost. We have failed to remember that it is a sacrament meeting and that the bishop presides.

There are many things I could say about such matters as wearing Sunday best. Do you know what "Sunday best" means? It used to be the case. Now we see ever more informal, even slouchy, clothing in our meetings, even in sacrament meeting, that leads to informal and slouchy conduct.

Here is a link to the whole talk:

It's unbelievable, arrogant and disgusting. It truly shows who this man really is. In other words, let's take advantage of people at their lowest point, to try to convert them to the Mormon Church. The entire purpose of a funeral is to Convert people and has nothing to do with the deceased? Is he smoking crack? I just can't believe that he then begins to ask, like we are all stupid little 2 year olds, if we even know what "Sunday Best" even is.

Let me tell you something Mr. Packer, I served a mission in South America where people wore rags to Church, are you condemning them? Are you mocking their poverty as you strut around in your $1,000 + suits without a care in the world due to your healthy "paycheck" that God gives you every month?

I think I'll head down to South America and share your "inspired" words with everybody and see what happens. Maybe they can sell you their gold fillings to help build a temple in Brazil? Oh wait, they already did that!! Maybe they can give you 1 out of every 10 chicken eggs, oh wait, the Church does that in Africa!! Plain and simple, the Mormon Church is filthy rich and robs from the poor to continue on with their lifestyles of filth lucre!!

What an arrogant, condescending, pompous ass!! I can see why this talk had to be "Whitewashed."

At least he gave "permission" for someone from the family of the deceased to actually talk but only if "their remarks should be in keeping with the spirit of the meeting." How nice of him!! If he hadn't, it wouldn't be allowed. Amazing how comments or opinions become commandments, kind of like the whole 2 earring BS by Hinckley, Ballard and then Bednar.

Now I've also been to funerals of past Bishop's and guess what, it was all about the Bishop, what a great guy he was, how loving, how wonderful, etc. So once again, they are hypocrites, do as we say, not as we do. They live by a different set of laws and standards then us normal peon's and who are we to question God's anointed. Damn cult!!

You see, this talk, still exists internally in the Church, is used in Religion courses to study, but isn't "officially" available to the public on the Churches website. I guess I feel the need to show the "wanna be TBM's" that lurk around on this site, proof, absolute proof that this talk did exist, so they don't think we are making it up.

Isn't it interesting how many talks that Boyd K. Packer has given that "don't exist" anymore. Let's see, "The Little Factory" talk was removed from the Priesthood session in which it was given, 1976. Notice that there are only 4 talks instead of the normal 5. The "To the One" talk is not on the speeches website that goes back to March 5, 1978 at a 12 Stake Fireside at BYU. Now we discover that "The Unwritten Order of Things" also given at BYU, in 1996, like "To the One", doesn't exist either.

This begs another question. Why do they always go to BYU to deliver these controversial talks. I want to see it in General Conference. Bednar and earrings, we are against homosexuals, don't talk about the deceased at funerals, Mark E. Peterson's "racist" talk in I think 1954. I mean, come one guys, why do you have to hide out at BYU to give these ridiculous and offensive talks. Tell the whole world what you believe, you damn cowards!! Quit hiding at BYU and then "whitewashing" your talk when it is deemed too offensive!!

Now, something else that I've had on my mind for a few weeks now. First of all, for those of you that seem to be so offended by my anger or others anger at these types of things, for those that appear to be so passive about everything, do me and yourself a favor and don't click on my links or others that you don't like. Nobody is forcing you to read it!! I've seen those "passive people", that are offended by any anger, tell others not to click on their links if they don't like what they have to say. I'm sick of people trying to tell me that this stuff shouldn't make me angry. Fine, you have a right to not care and be passive and I have a right to be pissed off, right? You know who you are!!

How about we respect each other and pretend that we aren't in the Morg, where everyone has to believe and think the same way like they are robots. I don't have a problem with people that aren't bothered with these types of things, have no anger, etc. I may not understand it but I know that it is their way and their right to feel how they feel. But I do have a problem with people that don't have any anger, telling me, that I should think like them and not have any anger. Everyone has the right to feel how they feel. I know this may seem strange to a "Morgbot" but we do our freedom, don't we?

Sometimes on this board, as I read responses to people's posts, I feel like I'm back in the Mormon Church and that everyone is expected to conform and all think alike in order to keep everyone happy. I didn't leave the Church and gain my freedom, just to give it away again. It's okay to disagree and not understand, but we don't need to attack each other!!

Most people on this board, in my opinion, are all either heading in the same basic direction or already there, we are just all taking our own paths and what is wrong with that? I know that the "mind frame", it has to be my way or no way thinking, comes from the brainwashing since birth from the Mormon Church. We all have to try a little harder to respect each other and our personal and distinct paths, that is all that I'm saying.

Lately, I've just seen too many people that feel like everyone has to think only one way and we've all been guilty of that at one point or another. A lot of us have incredible passion that has come with our new knowledge that we have been deceived and lied to for our entire life. The point of this board, is for us to be able to express ourselves, recover from Mormonism, and we all have our own paths to take, so all I ask is a little respect, on both sides. Let's let people say what they feel and express themselves in a way that makes them comfortable individually. If "wanna be TBM's" or "True TBM's" or "TBM's in transition", those exmo's with active spouses, etc, are lurking around and my words offend them, who cares? Like Hinckley says about all the different versions of the "First Vision", so what?

I love this place and it has been a huge part of my healing and recovery. I love the diversity of people and opinions and the knowledge that I gain here. My anger isn't once what it was, even a month ago, but I'm still angry when I read this kind of crap by a supposed Apostle of God. Who does Boyd K Packer think he is to have so much control over members of the Church? It is sad!! I can't help that it makes me angry and I'm not gonna apologize to those who don't get angry over it. To me and many others, this is a big deal!! I don't think anybody wants to be like Boyd K. Packer with a "God complex!!" To each their own, let's just have respect for one another!!


Samuel the Utahnite

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13 Comments:

At Saturday, August 26, 2006 7:00:00 PM, Anonymous Sean D. said...

"It's okay to disagree and not understand, but we don't need to attack each other!!"

I know it is really hard to think clearly when you are angry but come on... for you to make this statement right after the rant you just went on... you must be smokin some of that same stuff Pres. Packard is smokin.
It has been my expereince that people don't recover from mormonism they rebell against it... it seems to consume thier lives even more than when they were faithful members of the church... why is that?
The whole clothes thing... do you think it might be possible that Pres. Packard was talking to people who could be wearing more appropriate clothes... who have been taught the symbolism behind the white shirt and tie and the importance of modesty. And the tithing thing with the chickens... you must not even be a christian anymore because Christ requires tithing to be paid by all, rich or poor... does the widow and the two mites ring a bell?
If you don't want to be a member anymore then move on, that is your right, but bashing a man (putting the church aside) that has dedicated his life to service the way you do... it's just wrong.
So I am going to follow your advice and agree that it is okay to disagree and to not understand because I don't understand why you feel so betrayed. But I do have an idea... the next time you are going to sit down and rant on, why don't you go do something positive first like volunteer at the hospital or food bank then sit down at your computer and give it a whirl. I'm sure your speaches will be a little calmer allowing you to think a little more clearly.

 
At Wednesday, November 08, 2006 4:05:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Boyd K Packer is correct. I want my funeral also used to help people get closer to Christ. He is the reason we get to live forever, be resurrected, find forgiveness for our sins. Boyd is doing just fine in this talk. All of out attention at any time should be on the savior and his gospel. I am deeply sorry you have been offended and have such bad feelings. I hope you go back to prayer and ask Father about the Church again. It is true, I know it and you once knew it, right?

 
At Monday, December 11, 2006 7:47:00 PM, Anonymous Erik said...

Your obvious exceeding anger in this article may have dismayed and distracted some people from your main point. i took your main point to be that Boyd K. Packer powertrips to the extent of trying to control funerals by forcing bishops to control them and to have the funeral barely even mention the person that the funeral is being held for! I do miss the way the missionary farewells used to be held. it is so impersonal now. If you have a mormon funeral or missionary farewell according to Boyd K. packers 'orders' it is an incredible loss in personality. You barely realize that the person is leaving or has died. 'focus on spiritual learning.' save that for sunday school please, i want to see my brother off and i want to talk about my mother that just died. I agree with the author of this article. Screw Boyd K. Packer. He is an uninspired terrible man and i will never sustain him again. The things that he has said about femininism, sexuality, and many little topics like the one you adress here have damaged so many peoples lives and have lead so many astray. nice article. even if a little angry hehe. it's warranted anger in my opinion.
-Erik

 
At Sunday, February 18, 2007 1:52:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

It's unfortunate that the *truth* setting you *free* is misunderstanding and anger. One can control nobody but one's own self--obsessing over *exposure* and hatred only makes the obsessed full of hate.

Luckily, we all have the freedom of speech, including those who choose to slander and speak ill of others. And same as those who feel compelled to place sacred things in sacred places--reunions don't need to take place in the chapel. Wait an hour and let others meditate and reflect on Christ. I think that is Who you are forgetting. When any speak of learning more of Christ and His Atonement we should fall to our knees in humility and gratitude and not worry about small things that only fill us with pain and hatred.

"Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you. Not as the world giveth, give I unto you, let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid."

--Utah Utes by 5--

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 9:54:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I just read the paragraph on funerals and re-read and still don't see where it says "The entire purpose of a funeral is to Convert people and has nothing to do with the deceased? "

I do read that it says the purpose of the service is to bring the spirit and comforting words.

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 2:13:00 PM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Here, let me help you out:

They should not yield the arrangement for funerals or missionary farewells to families. It is not the proper order of things for members or families to expect to decide who will speak and for how long. Suggestions are in order, of course, but the bishop should not turn the meeting over to them. We are worried about the drift that is occurring in our meetings.

Funerals could and should be the most spiritually impressive. They are becoming informal family reunions in front of ward members. Often the Spirit is repulsed by humorous experiences or jokes when the time could be devoted to teaching the things of the Spirit, even the sacred things."

When the family insists that several family members speak in a funeral, we hear about the deceased instead of about the Atonement, the Resurrection, and the comforting promises revealed in the scriptures. Now it's all right to have a family member speak at a funeral, but if they do, their remarks should be in keeping with the spirit of the meeting.

I have told my Brethren in that day when my funeral is held, if any of them who speak talk about me, I will raise up and correct them. The gospel is to be preached. I know of no meeting where the congregation is in a better state of readiness to receive revelation and inspiration from a speaker than they are at a funeral. This privilege is being taken away from us because we don't understand the order of things--the unwritten order of things--that relates to the administration of the Church and the reception of the Spirit.

Our bishops should not give our meetings away. That is true of our missionary farewells. We're deeply worried that they now have become kind of reunions in front of ward members. The depth of spiritual training and teaching which could go on is being lost. We have failed to remember that it is a sacrament meeting and that the bishop presides.


Okay, I have no idea what your confusion is, other than your brain is so clouded from your "burning bosom", that you actually can't see or comprehend the words, that are PERFECTLY CLEAR. A little kid could understand them better than you do for hell's sake!!

The first paragraph discusses that Bishops should never "yield the arrangement for funerals", to the family of the deceased. You okay with that? I'm sure you are!! He's worried about "the drift" that is occurring due to this and the suggestions of family members. PATHETIC!! Yeah, who gives a shit about the grieving family members, right?

The next paragraph clearly points out that he's disgusted by the fact that funerals are "becoming informal family reunions in front of ward members" and that the spirit is repulsed when they share(GASP) "humorous experiences or jokes when the time could be devoted to teaching the things of the Spirit, even the sacred things."

Now the final paragraph is the one that you can't seem to wrap your brain around. He says "When the family insists that several family members speak in a funeral, WE HEAR ABOUT THE DECEASED instead of about the Atonement, the Resurrection, and the comforting promises revealed in the scriptures.

Packer also says, "Now it's all right to have a family member speak at a funeral, but if they do, their remarks should be in keeping with the spirit of the meeting." So what would he consider "KEEPING WITH THE SPIRIT OF THE MEETING?" Not talking about the deceased or sharing any humorous or funny experiences or jokes? What an ASSHOLE!!

You get it now? Yeah, Mormon God forbid the family gets too involved, reunites with other GRIEVING family members, like a family reunion in front of the Goddamn precious ward members(I'm sure it would sicken them). Mormon God forbid that they share funny stories about the person, to make themselves and others feel better with good memories and finally, Packer is afraid that you will actually "hear about the deceased instead of about the Atonement, the Resurrection, and the comforting promises revealed in the scriptures."

Packer then says, "I have told my Brethren in that day when my funeral is held, IF ANY OF THEM WHO SPEAK TALK ABOUT ME, I WILL RAISE UP AND CORRECT THEM. THE GOSPEL IS TO BE PREACHED.

He then pathetically goes into how spiritually ready everyone is to hear the Gospel at a funeral and says, "I know of no meeting where the congregation is in a better state of readiness to receive revelation and inspiration from a speaker than they are at a funeral." It's always about the numbers and baptizing people, isn't it? Again, who gives a shit about the deceased, or their family or friends, just teach that Goddamn gospel and fire up the baptismal font....let's throw then down ASAP!!

It can't be any clearer that that and fully supports my statement of "The entire purpose of a funeral is to Convert people and has nothing to do with the deceased?" I mean hey, you aren't even supposed to talk about the deceased, according to Packer. How can you miss this and not understand it? It's crystal clear and maybe you should read it with a friend or family member or a non-Mormon(someone whose brain isn't clouded by some magical, burning bosom) and they will help you understand what it says. I mean put it all together man, it's not that complicated if you understand basic English!!

Samuel

 
At Monday, November 26, 2007 7:29:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

These old hardasses will die off. The church does change and evolve. I too have plenty of heartburn, but this culture and lifestyle has been very good to me. I believe there is a ton of truth in the church and I believe there is more than in any other church. Show me another church that has the correct interpretation of the nature of the Godhead. I am not a diciple of Constantine.

 
At Saturday, February 16, 2008 5:33:00 PM, Anonymous INTJ Mom said...

I can't find the 1981 talk by Packer entitled "The Mantle is Far Far Greater Than The Intellect" anywhere either.

The last Mormon funeral I went to, about 2 years ago, made me want to puke. An infant had died and the ward leaders stood up & told the family it was wrong for them to mourn their child. They were supposed be happy that their child was dead & would be automatically received into the Celestial Kingdom. The mom was sitting up on the front row loudly crying her eyes out the entire service, yet noone acknowledged her or her pain. It was so wrong and so uncaring & uncompassionate. I've never been able to set foot in a Mormon church building since then.

 
At Thursday, February 21, 2008 1:45:00 PM, Anonymous Perry L. Porter said...

I went to a funeral last Monday and one speaker had everyone crying one second and laughing their head off the next.

Boyd would not have approved, but he can just go to hell!

BTW a talk that contains some of the same phrases by Boyd IS on file on lds.org.

Searching on "Our bishops should not give our meetings away" and all church content you will find:

Funerals - A Time for Reverence
Boyd K. Packer

Music should be used at the beginning of the service prior to the opening prayer and possibly after the invocation also, as in our Sunday meetings. Bishops should remember that when funerals are held under priesthood auspices the service should conform to the instructions given by the Church.

Gospel Library > Magazines > Ensign > November 1988

I think he used part of his old talk when giving the talk at BYU.

Perry L. Porter

 
At Sunday, October 05, 2008 2:14:00 PM, Blogger luna96 said...

Out of curiosity, what do you believe is the true church then? i can say that i do feel uncomfortable with most of the talk on funerals but even so, i find more truth in this church than others. I am still learning and i'm still trying to find out what everything means and why we have so many rules and expectations in this church but many good things have come out of this religion. i can see where you're getting at and i don't like to lecture others so i'll just say what i believe. i believe that even though there are many things people disagree with in this church, everyone has their own thoughts on everything. People can say what they want but it doesn't mean that everyone feels the same way. i disagree with what he has to say about funrals but i still feel that this church is true for the most part.

 
At Thursday, October 23, 2008 2:43:00 PM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Thanks for the comment Luna. I don't believe that any church is the "true church"(why does there have to be a "true church") and that they are all nothing but complete bullshit, fairy tales, fantasies and burning bosoms, all based on lies, fraud superstition and the Bible, which is nothing but a complete joke and not the word of any "God" or "Jesus"…or at I least I hope it isn’t. It can easily be disproved with just an ounce of common sense, logic and common decency…which billions of people obviously lack.

If it is the "word of God"(and if that’s the case, I hope to never meet the asshole), then "God/Jesus/Jehovah" are evil and vile bastards and worse than any Devil could ever be and ANY church based on them and their horrific teachings are supporters of said "God/Jesus/Jehovah" and their brutal teachings of rape, murder, torture, slavery, genocide, causing abortions(all done in the name of and on behalf of said bloodthirsty "God"), etc, etc.

Have you even bothered to read the Old Testament? Do you even know what's in it? Most don’t or just don’t care and I was pretty damn ignorant myself, before I saw the light, accepted reality and stopped making excuses for the all mighty killer/raper/torturer “God.” ALL religions cherry pick the good stuff from the Bible and leave out the bad, as if it doesn’t exist, in order to prove their particular brand of bullshit fairy tale and “God” to be true, which pads their pockets as they smile all the way to the bank, laughing at everyone‘s stupidity.

ALL religions are just used car lots, full of lying, scumbag salesmen(who claim to represent and speak on behalf of some invisible "GOD"), who take great advantage of their ignorant customers, who conveniently and purposely forget to tell you that the car you’re about to buy, that is sold “as is”, is really a complete piece of shit and not what it appears to be. Would you ever buy a car, just because the salesman and the car he showed you made your bosom burn?

I hope not and we should be stricter in our studies before joining some life changing, blood/money sucking cult, over buying a used car. It’s amazing how so many people use logic, intelligence and common sense in EVERY aspect of their life but their religious beliefs, which makes them look pretty stupid. How can an otherwise intelligent man look so dumb?

I can say this because I was once in that category myself and threw all logic and common sense out the window like the brainwashed idiot I was. I have always been a VERY analytical person, that studied all angles of an issue, relied on the facts and truth(or so I thought)…except when it came to my religion of MORmONISM.

I always had a thousand questions regarding things that didn’t make sense…but I just ignored them and went on believing, like the sheep I was, that it would all suddenly make sense on the other side, which doesn‘t make any sense. If it doesn’t make any sense here knowing all the facts; why would it make any sense there, knowing the same facts?

All churches have one thing in common when you think about it; THEY are the ONE and ONLY TRUE CHURCH and all other churches are false and NO ONE can be saved except in their religion. So EVERY OTHER CHURCH is false, except the one you were lucky enough to land it, right? How absurd!!

That is their marketing campaign to bring in more people, through fear and threats, in order to generate more power and income, which is the bottom line and only reason for the existence of any church/cult.

Joseph Smith’s first vision and Book of hate and fantasy(MORmON) clearly state that ALL OTHER RELIGIONS are FALSE, CORRUPT, ABOMINATIONS, OF THE DEVIL, WHORES OF ALL THE EARTH, MOTHERS OF HARLOTS, etc.

Pretty strange for the Mormon church to be openly trashing ALL OTHER RELIGIONS, especially since the dead Prophet Gordon B. Hinckley always said, “we never speak negatively of other religions.”

The current asshole Catholic Pope(who helped facilitate the cover-up of the Priest sex scandal) says that all other religions outside of Catholicism, don't even deserve be called churches, showing his arrogance and hatred of all other religions.

I was just reading Spencer W. Kimball’s Miracle Of Forgiveness tonight(on display and praised in the Mormon church‘s family history museum, right across from temple square in Salt Lake City), where he emphatically states that NO ONE can receive exaltation, Celestial glory or have an eternal family, unless they are a righteous Mormon.

Mormons are now trying to soften their public teachings about how they condemn, reject and hate EVERYONE that isn’t Mormon(especially if they’ve left the church like me or been taught and have already rejected it), while privately having their 50,000 + missionaries continue to teach their hatred and bigotry behind the scenes, regarding ALL OTHER RELIGIONS on a daily basis.

The Mormon hierarchy and most Mormons are absolutely desperate to be accepted as mainstream Christians(now sticking steeples on all their buildings at $50,000 + a pop), when they are anything but mainstream and 100% despise and reject the teachings of mainstream Christianity and the very mainstream Christians that they want so desperately to accept them.

Even Hinckley taught that Mormons reject the Jesus of mainstream Christianity and believe in Joseph Smith’s Jesus Christ. Did he think that teaching would make Christians love them more? So why would they want to be seen as something that they hate and condemn every single day and in every General Conference, as they preach THEY ARE THE ONLY TRUTH?

Anyway, keep seeking THE TRUTH and don’t buy what the snake oil salesmen are selling, because all that matters is their bottom line and how much money they can scare out of you, in order to help you buy your way into their magical, non-existent heaven and Celestial glory. If "God" is all powerful, he certainly doesn’t need your money, as he can just print his own on his celestial printing press and send it down to “his servants“, right?

Ask yourself why you are so desperate to need religion. Is it just because you’ve been taught from birth(brainwashed) that you need it? Is it because you’re afraid to think for yourself? Are you afraid of just saying “I don’t know?” What will they do for you? How can they claim speak for an invisible “God/Jesus”, that nobody ever sees or hears, with ZERO PROOF, that one word came from him?

I might as well claim I’m “God/Jesus” and tell people to give me their money or I’ll destroy them and cut them off from their families, right? At least I’d be here on earth to be seen and heard, unlike this silent, invisible, do nothing “God!!”

The only power and authority that they have, is what you give them. If EVERYONE left the MORmON church tomorrow, Tommy Boy and gang would have all of their billions that they raped the members for, but no authority and no church.

Well, take care and I look forward to your response and good luck on your journey. Remember that it’s okay to ask questions, to strongly and openly disagree and don’t be afraid to ask the most important question; “is the Mormon church false?” Don’t just pray to know that the church and book of MORmON are true, like they teach you to do...but rather ask if they are false, using common sense, logic, reasoning and intelligence.(throw out the burning bosom bullshit)

Why would God answer anyone’s prayer about the whether the MORmON church or the Book of MORmON is true, when 25,000 kids a day, all around the world, are dying from starvation, with ZERO help or prayer answering from this supposed "loving God?”(our "father") Would that be just? Maybe he just lets them die and doesn't care about them because they aren't worthy MORmONS?!!

What about all of the innocent men, women and children who are raped, tortured and killed every single day, with absolutely no intervention from "God?" Yet MORmONS, Christians and other religions believe that "God" is only listening to them and answering their prayers about stupid, little meaningless stuff.

If God doesn't care about the millions who die and suffer every day, why would he have a "true church?"

Just read or listen to Tommy Boy’s last conference talk, where he talked and bragged about his “God” controlling the weather and rain, so the Saints didn’t get rained on. Wow, he’s actually bragging that keeping the Saints dry from some harmless rain, is more important than protecting all the innocent men, women, children and babies? What an arrogant, callous, stupid man!!

Tommy Boy said:

The evening before each of the temple dedications took place, magnificent cultural events were held. In Curitiba, Brazil, 4,330 members from the temple district, supported by a choir of 1,700 voices, presented a most inspirational program through song, dance, and video. The enormous soccer stadium where the event took place was filled with spectators. The wind had been blowing, and rain threatened. I offered a silent prayer asking Heavenly Father to look with mercy upon those who had prepared so diligently for our entertainment and whose costumes and presentations would be damaged if a heavy rain or wind enveloped them. He honored that prayer, and it wasn’t until the end of the show and later on that evening that rain fell in abundance.

Are you fucking kidding me? So Tommy Boy can control the elements but can't even detect pedophile Bishops and Stake Presidents among his flock? He can't predict Tsunamis(where 250,000 died), earthquakes, fires, rapes, murders, etc, but he can stop it from raining? Anyone that actually believes this is dumber than a fucking rock in the ground!!

If Tommy Monsoon can control when it rains, why couldn't he just as easily stop a Tsunami, with one of his "silent prayers" and prevent mass death? Why is whether it rains on the Mormons in Brazil more important than saving a child from being raped and molested by a MORmON missionary, MTC teacher, boy scout leader, Sunday school teacher, BYU professor, MORmON Tabernacle Choir member, Bishop, Stake President, Seventy or anybody for that matter?

I guess this clearly shows the priorities of the the "one and only true MORmON God", doesn't it?

THINK ABOUT IT FOLKS!! USE YOUR BRAINS AND COMMON SENSE!!

So, what happened when all the Saints died and froze to death on their way to Utah? I guess their asshole “God” took a vacation eh? Maybe they just weren't as worthy and valiant as the Saints in Brazil, that didn't get rained on...LOL?!!

What happened on 911 or with the latest floods around the world or with the latest earthquakes in China, where countless thousands died? I guess the "MORmON God" just gave them the big FUCK YOU and let them die, while making sure it didn't rain somewhere and get Tommy Boy and the Saints wet and oh yeah, he was busy making sure they "felt the spirit"(burning bosoms) in Sacrament meeting and during General Conference.

Isn't it OBVIOUS what's going on here?

If you're truly worried about which church is the "one and only true church", cross MORmONISM off of your list, as I'm sure it wouldn't be the church, in 2008, that accounts for less than 1/5 of 1% of the world's population...of which only about 25% are active.(1/20th of 1% of the world's population)

If MORmONISM was a corporation, all of the First Presidency, Apostles and Seventies would be fired by the board and they would be bankrupt and out of business...but they answer to NOBODY, so that doesn't happen.

Best wishes,

Samuel

 
At Saturday, November 15, 2008 10:24:00 PM, Blogger Sierra said...

Samuel:
Your words come straight from your heart and mind, and I deeply respect that. I am so glad you found the truth and are able to express yourself without inhibition. I was linked to your blog from Google whilst searching for "violence in Torreon, Mexico." Today my brother received his mission call to that city and I am very worried for his safety after reading the article posted on your blog. The information you posted regarding the church's thoughts on the poor missionary who got his nose busted just made me sick. I live across the country from my brother and wasn't planning on seeing him off for his mission (since I'm the only exmo, I'm sorta the outsider in the fam but I still care for them of course), but now I feel it may be my last time to see him again. :( Thanks for your thoughts. Sierra

 
At Monday, November 17, 2008 3:00:00 PM, Blogger twigs said...

Elder Holland's quote “May I suggest that wherever possible a white shirt be worn by the deacons, teachers, and priests who handle the sacrament. For sacred ordinances in the Church we often use ceremonial clothing, and a white shirt could be seen as a gentle reminder of the white clothing you wore in the baptismal font and an anticipation of the white shirt you will soon wear into the temple and onto your missions” (“This Do in Remembrance of Me,” Ensign, Nov. 1995, 68).
is marked by the fruits of the Spirit—”gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, [and] temperance” (Galatians 5:22–23)"
and is true counsel that blesses my life.

 

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