Wednesday, March 14, 2007

Hey Everyone, These Loving Christians Are Now Threatening To Have My Entire Blog Deleted Through Hacking. So, If It Vanishes...We Know Who Did it!!


I'm going to start out by saying that I have no idea who is sending me these threatening Emails, so I'm not going to accuse anybody personally, as that would be foolish. I do know however that this person or group of people are in the Evangelical movement, and deeply involved in the passing out of these DVDS, but I have no idea how high up the ladder it goes.

These Emails tell me that I've permanently damaged their plan and caused them irreparable harm financially and that they are going to pay me back. Yeah, well maybe they shouldn't have "secret combinations" going on and moles on the inside feeding this information to people on the outside like myself.

Maybe they need to get their shit together and find out who the loose end is and worry about themselves and their problems, not me. I'm the least of their problems right now, as any future projects they plan on doing, will be made public knowledge through me or somebody else that is chosen by their mole to release it.


So, on one hand, they have a mole, exposing all their plans and then on the other hand, they have members of their organization that are now willing to participate in criminal activities, in order to silence me or others.

Guys, seriously, right your own ship and quit worrying about me and what I'm doing or saying, because your organization appears to be completely spinning out of control at the moment and you all need to do some very serious introspection.

They have basically told me to either remove the post immediately or "suffer the consequences of having all of my blogs hacked and deleted." They say that they "know people who can take care of this for them." Yeah, this is very Christlike and ethical, isn't it?


And they claim that the Mormon Hierarchy tries to control the flow of information and suppresses their members and their freedom of speech? What the hell would you call this? Is this Christlike and what their Jesus would have them do? Is this how they think it should work...the ol' "nothing is too good for the Lord", even if it's criminal?

I'm going to say again, so that it's crystal clear, that I have NO IDEA, who is behind this potential criminal activity, or if they intend to follow through with it; but I am in touch with who I need to be, regarding all of this and those involved will be very very sorry and I plan on pressing charges to the full extent of the law, if they carry out their plan and delete my blogs and constitutionally protected free speech.

Amazing isn't it, that here in the USA, even the FBI and CIA don't delete bloggers who compare the President to Hitler, or burn American flags in the streets or even worse(it's called freedom folks), but yet these Evangelicals want to delete my blog and silence me and take away my constitutional rights to freedom of speech, because I blew the cover on their little plan to Evangelize all the Mormons.

I also want and need to say, that as much as I strongly dislike and disagree with the beliefs and methods of Eric Hoffman, Aaron Shafovaloff and many others, that are locally involved in this project; I don't believe that they would ever be behind something criminal like this or encourage it.

Yeah, now I'm even defending them too, because I have to...man, this has been a strange week, hasn't it? These guys are die-hards in their beliefs but I don't think they want to be reading the Bible while sitting in prison and are much smarter than that and they have families, kids, etc. I just don't believe in my heart, that they would ever do such a thing and cross that line and so we need to find out who it is that is behind this and look for the "real source."

I don't know if any of you Evangelicals out there reading this, are aware of these plans to hack and delete my blog or know of them(they claim that you do), or have been contacted about them, but just a quick warning; if you know about it and do nothing, and basically sit by and allow it to happen, you are complicit as well, which isn't a good thing. If any of you out there know who is behind it, do them and yourself a big favor and stop them, before they permanently screw up their lives and drag you into it.

Anyway, just wanted to let all "Mormon Truth" readers know what was going on and that if my blogs suddenly vanish today or in the near future, you know who did it and why. The good news is that I have multiple copies of all my blogs and they will be posted right back up on the Internet and running within the day, if someone does actually try to do this.

So, not only will their criminal attempts to hack my blog and silence me fail, and cause them immense personal pain in their life(and that of their family and loved ones) legally, emotionally, etc, but I will be right back up again, with the same exact information that they just deleted and it will have all been for nothing.

But then again, criminals usually have little or no common sense and live for the moment, without any thought to what will happen if they get caught. Anybody ever watch the weekly Dateline series "To Catch A Predator?" Yeah, if you have, you know what I mean. They are willing to literally throw away their whole life and future(and cause terrible pain to their family) and be stamped a sexual predator for life, all for a few minutes of self-gratification.

Damn and to think that I originally backed up my blogs in case some die-hard Mormon tried to delete them; I never imagined that it would be an Evangelical Christian instead. Well, I guess we'll see what happens today.

I appreciate everyone's support and always remember that "the truth shall set you free!!"

Samuel the Utahnite

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46 Comments:

At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 6:45:00 AM, Anonymous ray said...

Samuel,

I can understand how they are upset, for sure. All religion is a business and money is the bottom line.

If you haven't already, I would suggest re-setting your password with as many characters as possible as well as using a combination of upper and lower case letters and numbers.

This comment area is a little different that it usually is. The "Leave your comment" box is centered where it is usually on the left.

Also, the word verification is now higher than it was. It used to be at the bottom of the box.

I don't know if its anything to worry about but I thought I'd at least bring it to your attention.

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 8:25:00 AM, Blogger Spencer said...

Samuel,

I'm the fellow that came across your earlier blog post about this Evangelical "outreach" and posted a link to your post over on the MormonApologetics message board.

I've posted an update about the threats against your blog. I hope those making these threats think better of it.

Although we apparently have significant differences of opinion regarding the LDS Church, I respect and appreciate your sense or propriety and fair play.

Thanks,

-Smac

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 8:32:00 AM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Thanks Ray, great advice and it's taken care off.

And you're right, religion is always about nothing more than business and money, whether it's Mormon Inc or Evangelical Inc, it's all the same. Now, if they really want to hack into Google and do some serious time in a federal prison, they should go for it!!

I'll be anxious to see if any of the Evangelicals come in here and will actually admit to knowing about this. All I know is I've been told that they've been told, by the same source that wants to hack my blog, so who knows? My guess is that they do know all about it, don't know what to do about it and maybe I'll find out for sure, if they know or not at some point.

I hope that if they are indeed aware of it, and really have been notified, that they will find out who it is, since the Email I got was anonymous. I'm sure that they'll do the right and smart thing and not want to be involved in this or be associated with it or linked to it.

Like I said in this post; they need to do some serious house cleaning and worry about themselves and what is going on internally in their "ministry", than anything that I'm saying or doing. I'm simply a minor symptom of a very serious disease, that is going to rot them from the inside out, if they don't figure out what's going on and put an immediate stop to it.

Take care guys,

Samuel

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 8:52:00 AM, Blogger Aaron Shafovaloff said...

Samuel,

You'd be better off corroborating some things to make sure they are facts, before you keep heaping on the slander.

Eric Hoffman received a very suspicious e-mail asking if he could help take down your blog. He forwarded the e-mail to a bunch of us involved in the DVD distro and we all immediately recognized it as fake. Someone was very obviously trying to solicit Eric to consent to such an unethical idea (which Eric and everyone outright rejected). This is what I wrote back:

I hope I'm right in saying that this sounds really fake. I have a hard time believing that a Christian would be so apparently interested in being unethical about this. It sounds like someone wants to illicit a response from Eric and use it against him. I recommend replying and saying that God is in control, "Samuel" has already publicized the distribution, and that as Christians we will in no way be unethical in an attempt to suppress him. We have nothing to hide anymore. Our biggest worry was that the leadership would get Mormons not to listen to it. I think at this point the only damage to be done is warnings giving at the local ward level. But I honestly believe the negative impact will be minimal.

Satan is attacking hard, let's smile in his face and joyfully say, "Jesus is on his throne!"

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:04:00 AM, Blogger Eric Hoffman said...

Samuel,
I behalf of myself and my other brothers and sisters who are strong in the Lord, I can assure these emails were not sent to you by any of us.
Hacking a blog is illegal and dishonest.

You wrote:

”I'm going to start out by saying that I have no idea who is sending me these threatening Emails,”

This is another thing that shows me that this could very well be an imposter who is posing as a Christian. Anon. emails come from people who wish to hide. I can say that dishonesty and hiding is not our motive. This person/people who are sending these emails are trying to distort you into thinking that, for the most part Christians are mean dishonest and unloving if pushed far enough. Just to give you heads up. Last night I received an email from a person who posed as a brother in Christ. They requested to...now, I quote:

“Use whatever means possible to stop your blog!”

And,

“We do not care what actions you take”

I rejected this persons request. In fact the writing style and world views match a person who posts on your blog quite frequently. I cannot say for sure, but when it quacks like a duck and looks like a duck….well. Most of the people I have talked to are not all that bothered by your post about the DVD.
In fact some even consider it a blessing.

Samuel, please try to discern the truth from who is trying to deceive you.

In Him,
-Eric Hoffman

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:23:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

*Heavy sigh* Has it ever occured to you that the Evangelicals are not planning on hacking your blog, but that the mole told you they are in an effort to publicly discredit them? Like you said, you have no clue who is making these threats. That being the case, it is just as likely, if not more so, that a Mormon has made these empty threats.

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:24:00 AM, Blogger Aaron Shafovaloff said...

"Samuel",

I should make a clarification.

I do appreciate you assuming that neither I or Eric would ever try to hack your blog.

The "slander" I speak of us this: You yourself admit you have "no idea" who sent the e-mail to you, yet you entitled your blog post, "These Loving Christians Are Now Threatening To..."

So it seems that while you tried to cover your bases, you still intentionally gave the impression you knew the person threatening you was Christian. And by "these" Christians you give the impression that this person is involved in the DVD distro. I believe this is slanderous and that you ought to re-title your post to reflect corroborated facts.

Grace and peace,

Aaron

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 10:26:00 AM, Anonymous Timothy Oliver said...

Samuel,
I've never met you and only recently read your blog. Like you, I am a former Mormon. Unlike you, I also went on to become a follower of Christ.
Just writing to say that I believe Aaron and Eric are right about the probability that this hacker-threat is a Mormon trying to discredit the Evangelical's 316 Project. I received the same email as they did, and my immediate impression was just as Aaron's and Eric's. The whole thing just looked faked.
More specifically, I also want to say that I agree with Aaron that your blog headline, and some of your remarks, are rather slanderous, especially given that by your own admission you don't know who is threatening you.
You could publish the fact that you have been threatened, without assuming or claiming that it was by either the Evangelicals or the Mormons. Just stick to the facts and leave off the accusations, judgments, and hysteria, and you will be taken more seriously by all.
I don't know, in your current spiritual state, whether "grace and peace" has meaning for you. But that is my sincere and heart-felt closing to you---

Grace and peace,
Timothy Oliver

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 10:35:00 AM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Aaron(the guy asking Mormons if God the Father could have been a "homosexual drag queen"), you're now accusing me of slander? Are you serious?

I wake up to an Email from someone that claims to be from this Evangelical DVD movement, threatening to hack and delete my blogs and I'm out of line here, to think that it is someone within your organization? I'm the bad guy now, not him? I was supposed to simply say, "Oh, this isn't a big deal and I'm sure it isn't true and no one would be angry enough to hack my blog" and just go back to bed? What planet are you living on?

In fact, you give me ZERO credit, in all of your hasty desire to say I'm slandering you(This is low-blow, absolute slander). You later changed your tune to say "This isn't about any sort of personal accusation against me." Thank you for that!!

I said:

I also want and need to say, that as much as I strongly dislike and disagree with the beliefs and methods of Eric Hoffman, Aaron Shafovaloff and many others, that are locally involved in this project; I don't believe that they would ever be behind something criminal like this or encourage it.

Yeah, now I'm even defending them too, because I have to...man, this has been a strange week, hasn't it? These guys are die-hards in their beliefs but I don't think they want to be reading the Bible while sitting in prison and are much smarter than that and they have families, kids, etc. I just don't believe in my heart, that they would ever do such a thing and cross that line and so we need to find out who it is that is behind this and look for the "real source."


Damn and I thought I was being pretty fair and giving you the benefit of the doubt? Guess not!! And yeah, no religious Christian has ever broken the law, right? It just couldn't possibly happen, especially from your organization, where it's like everyone is living in Mr. Roger's Neighborhood, right? You are one naive dude, that's for sure.

I gave everyone here in Utah a pass(specifically YOU and ERIC) and the benefit of the doubt and that should have been sufficient. I assumed it was someone from outside of Utah and I guess I was right, if the guy is really from Cali, as he claims to be.

Okay, so I'll agree that we don't know who this man is or if he's an Evangelical or not. Satisfied? He at least represented himself as such and it wasn't some giant leap on my part to think that he was, which was of course just so that I could SLANDER you. I'll tell you what guys; figure out who this guy is and where the Email came from and then we'll know for sure and you can prove I was wrong.

Oh by the way, do you have proof that this man isn't an Evangelical, involved in this DVD campaign? You can't say he isn't and I can't say he is, but it seemed odd that someone would threaten me that didn't give a damn about it and so I just naturally assumed he was someone involved in the project, as he claimed to be.

He claimed to have notified you guys and so I was wondering if he had or not?

I also wanted everyone to know what was happening ASAP, in case something did happen to my blogs. I figured that I might as well cover my ass and post something before it got deleted and I'm sure you can comprehend that, right?

Oh by the way, I lost credibility, because I called Greg Johnson Greg Peterson by accident(even admitting that I wasn't 100% sure)?

Yeah dude, you lost all credibility with all Mormons, and even non-Mormons, when you started asking and wondering out loud if the Mormon God was once a "practicing homosexual" or a "homosexual drag queen." Is that how you plan to reach them, in order to teach them and convert them to your truth? Just a hint-it ain't gonna work!!

I just wanted to make sure that all the Mormons out there would know about your "slander" against the God they believe in and love, so that they could know who you really are and the kind of stuff you spew. Oh by the way, I'm not trying to convert Mormons, and claiming they will all collectively burn in hell, you are.

Even Eric, your friend, doesn't agree with all your methods, tactics, street preaching or asking that question of Robert Millet, in that particular forum and Greg Johnson certainly didn't agree. Those comments will be released from my 2nd Skypecast. You Aaron are nothing but a cancer to the very cause you represent!!(in my opinion of course)

At this rate, NO Mormons are going to watch your DVD as I've got their back on this one, when having to defend them against the likes of you and those that condemn them all to literally BURN. They say no publicity is bad publicity, so you're welcome in advance and like Eric said, many consider my post "a blessing."

So, let the blessings rain down upon you all and I'm sure your DVD project will be a smashing success, ordained of your God, that will surpass all of your expectations!! I'm just glad that your God saw to it that I was such an integral piece of your success.

Get the Counselors lined up and ready, because the Mormon stampede to convert is coming....LOL!!

I will end this comment with the audio clip of you Eric, condemning ALL Mormons with a blanket, "to lose their souls forever." When I asked you about it, you then said that "they wouldn't lose their souls", but that they would "burn in hell forever" and "gnash their teeth." Yes, that's much better and much more loving!!

Anyway, have a listen everyone, and it should give you some insight into what these guys are really preaching and trust me when I say; they are no friends of Mormons, as many of your probably already know.

Condemnation for ALL Mormons-by Eric Hoffman

He encourages everyone to Email him and let him know if he said anything incorrect or wrong, so for those reading this post over on the Mormon Apologetics board and listening to his words; drop him a line and let him know how you feel about his blanket condemnations of you.

It's funny how they are so deluded, as to actually think that Mormons will want to leave their Church, in order to believe what they believe, isn't it? It's like yeah, leave Mormonism, join us and then we can gang up on all of your family and friends and openly and strongly condemn them too, just like we condemned you...that is until you came to your senses and converted to our belief system.

Unbelievable!!

Samuel

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 11:15:00 AM, Blogger Aaron Shafovaloff said...

Samuel, maybe you didn't see my above comment where I started with, "I should make a clarification". I qualified my accusation against you and expressed gratitude for not assuming Eric or I would stoop to the unethical idea of hacking a blog.

"I was supposed to simply say, "Oh, this isn't a big deal and I'm sure it isn't true and no one would be angry enough to hack my blog" and just go back to bed?"

No, definitely not, but you should corroborate some things before associating this person with "these Christians". Especially given the degree of the sin/intended crime spoken of.

See a relevant post on MormonApologetics.org. I called the only S. Kinley of Arizona listed in the directory listing and a lady answered who said there is no "Mr. S. Kinley" that lives there. The "S" was a Miss (or Mrs.). The e-mailer named himself "Stephen Kinley" and apparently claimed to be at a school that doesn't exist. The evidence doesn't look good for Mr. "Kinley" even existing as such.

"Is that how you plan to reach them, in order to teach them and convert them to your truth?"

Maybe it'd help to get a broader picture of what I do instead of running with a single question I asked.

http://www.jesusnotjoseph.com/podcast

"I just wanted to make sure that all the Mormons out there would know about your "slander" against the God they believe in and love, so that they could know who you really are and the kind of stuff you spew."

Not all Mormons consider what I asked slander (and remember, I never accused any Mormon of teaching the certainty regarding God the Father's past, I instead asked a Mormon whether he thought something was possible regarding the Father's past), and in fact some have been positively open with me regarding the possibilities concerning God the Father's past. This really helps quickly differentiate traditional, Biblical Christianity with Mormonism. Traditional Lorenzo Snow couplet theology holds that God the Father was once a man like us (and more like us than Christ, since he, unlike Christ, had to prove his worthiness in his mortal probation unto godhood). Alonzo Gaskill, religion professor at BYU at least admits that we have to "probably" believe that God the Father once sinned in a mortal probation. Not all Mormons who concede this think it's possible that God the Father could have been sinful to the same degree that a person here on earth can be and still repent and be Celestially exalted unto godhood. But the reasons given usually have to do "personal" feelings, not an appeal to something specific within the system of Mormon theology. Thus the importance of pressing the question and one's reasoning for their answer.

So are you declining an offer to publicly speak with me over Skype?

Grace and peace,

Aaron

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 11:23:00 AM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Aaron,

I didn't see your last comment until after I'd posted my last comment. At least you are giving me credit for what I said regarding you and Eric, which is rather shocking, after your outright slander accusations.

Look, if you can prove that it isn't someone from your organization, I'll re-title the post. The fact is, you don't know and I don't know and my assumption is more likely right than yours, in my opinion. I don't feel that you should be dictating to me what I title my posts or telling me what my opinions are. From the Email I got and the information contained therein, I assume it to be a Christian.

"These Loving Christians" isn't a slanderous term at all and at least twice in the post, starting with the very first line, I state that I don't know who exactly is behind the threats and that I'm not accusing anyone personally.

So, are you saying that it's impossible for "any Christian" to have written those Emails? Do you know that aren't Christian? Do you have proof of that Aaron, before saying that I'm slandering you?

How about this? You issue a formal apology to ALL Mormons(over on the Mormon Apologetics board), about your remarks regarding God the Father possibly being a "homosexual drag queen" and a "practicing homosexual", admitting that those remarks were wrong and offensive and I'll consider re-titling the post? You want to tell me what to say, then I'll start telling you what to say. Maybe you should apologize to all homosexuals too, which you love so much of course. Sound fair?

Oh yeah and apologize to them for preaching that they will all "lose their souls forever" and be banned from the Kingdom of God forever, because they don't believe what you do. Maybe we'll let Eric handle that apology, since he's the one I have on audio saying it, although I'm sure you believe it too Aaron. Feel free to clarify, if you believe something different, than all Mormons burning in hell, okay?

You might as well apologize for secretly planning to target their homes, with your "unsolicited propaganda DVD" while you're at it.

I guess it's up to you now Aaron.

Samuel the Utahnite

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 11:38:00 AM, Blogger Lug Nutmegger said...

Samuel,

Long time listener...first time caller.

HOLY CRAP! Remind me not to get on your bad side.

As a "teeth gnasher" I don't particularly like the content of your blog but I do drop by once in a while to see what you have brewing and I am glad I did. This is absolutely hilarious.

When I read your first post yesterday about the massive door to door DVD distribution, I thought you were being "punk'd" by someone. But then I see that Mr. Hoffman and Mr. Shafovaloff confirm that there really is/was a "secret plan" to distribute the DVD's. I about fell over laughing.

Although I am a Mormon, I really have no dog in this fight. I don't live in the beehive state. I live in the "nutmeg" state, Connecticut. I doesn't bother me that there is a plan to distribute DVD's to Mormons in Utah or anywhere for that matter, in fact I say "good on ya" Evangelicals.

I do find the "secrecy" aspect a little disturbing. Don't these guys usually rag on us Mormons for being secretive? What, did they expect that the entire Mormon empire would be contacted through our intricate network of bat-phones to ensure we burn the DVD's and shun the messenger's?

Either way, I find this drama particularly amusing and I can't wait to see how it plays out. Keep up the fight and I hope no one disturbs your blog.

Lug...out

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 12:07:00 PM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Hey Aaron, did Alonzo Gaskill, the BYU Professor you speak of, feel that you slandered him and misrepresented his views on the whole "God the Father could have been a "practicing homosexual?" I have it on very good word that you never even asked him that specific question and that he was pretty pissed at you and felt that you completely misrepresented what he said, in order to accomplish your dishonest agenda. So, he taught that it was possible that God the Father could have sinned, but then you took that and ran with it, to ridiculous lengths, right?

Do you honestly think if you had asked Alonzo Gaskill, point blank; "do you believe God the Father was a 'practicing homosexual', that he would have said yes? Yeah, why ask the question, when you can just twist what he says to be whatever you want it to be, right?

Isn't it rather common for you Aaron to misrepresent yourself in order to twist people's words into something they weren't? And after what you pulled with Alonzo Gaskill, you have the gall to accuse me of slander? What is that about the mote in your own eye? Oh yeah, but you did nothing wrong, Alonzo Gaskill must be a liar, misrepresented you and slandered you, right? Aaron, do you believe you're a complete worthless pile as Eric does and has told me many times?

I know plenty of Good Christians/Mormons and you are certainly aren't one of them or someone to be trusted, in my opinion, if I'm allowed to have it, without you running around screaming SLANDER, SLANDER everyone. Maybe one of the people over on the Mormon Apologetics boards personally knows Alonzo Gaskill and can get him to post his personal experience with you and let everyone know the dirty tactics you use to accomplish your pathetic agenda of condemnation for all, that don't follow you.

My only purpose in even responding to your comments, is to expose you to all of the Mormons and Christians out there, many of whom are reading these posts and comments right now.

I want everyone to know who you really are Aaron and no, I wouldn't do a Skypecast with you if someone paid me good money, because I don't want anything to do with you or Eric, or any of you who believe like this and condemn all Mormons to fry in hell.

The only reason I debated Eric 2 weeks ago(after trying to get rid of him for the last 8 months), is because he came into my Skypecast and requested to talk.

I thought it might finally get rid of him, for once and for all, if I just let him say whatever it was he had to say. He still wanted to be my friend, after I've stated repeatedly and strongly, that I want nothing to do with him or his blanket condemnations ever again. It was a mistake to let him speak and a mistake I won't make again.

Quite frankly, you guys aren't worth my time or my listeners and readers time and I have much better things to do. It's really a shame that I've had to waste so much time this week dealing with you guys once again, but hey, if it helps expose you and your underhanded motives to all Mormons and others, then it was well worth the time.

If any of you come into my Skypecast, I will exercise my right to promptly eject you and you certainly won't get a chance to talk. Just go back and focus on your condemnation of the world and secret DVD handouts and wondering whether the Mormon's God the Father was a practicing homosexual and that should keep you busy for a while. By their fruits ye shall know them, right?!!

Now go find that damn mole of yours, before he exposes all your future plans to convert Mormons. As I've said several times; I'm the least of your worries pal!!

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 12:51:00 PM, Anonymous The Sinister Porpoise said...

While this may be exaggerated I will take this far out if this threat is serious. Sam and I have had our differences in the past and I may think he'd do better learning to keep his posts shorter, but he has a right to say what he wants.

You don't have to read it. And if it does happen, I will happily host this blog.

Remember the first amendment folks. Attack his ideas if you want, but not his expression.

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 2:02:00 PM, Anonymous Jeremy said...

Hey, Samuel,
the longer I read your blog, the more I think that you really are an American hero. Hero in the sense that you fight for freedom of speech, and for freedom of thought.
The LDS church constantly tries to control the thoughts of its members, and you expose the danger thereof.
Now, the evangelical church has its own tactics to gain more power to control and more money for its pastors. And again, you point your finger into the open wound.

It is great Samuel, to have such a brave person who does not step back when people like Aaron, Eric and that anonymous evangelical(?) attack you, and who shows how hideous people are, both the LDS hierarchy and the evangelical street pastors.

Like someone already said in this thread, I am looking forward to the 25. and see how things are going.
Maybe they have some success, but probably it will result in a big embarrassment for the evangelicals. The media will cover the disappointing results, many Mormons will complain about such intolerance, and maybe some people might hear about the LDS church for the first time, if the campaign "Jesus-loves-your-money 316" is broadcasted all over the world.

Hey folks, this is far more exciting and funny than TV, isn't it? (And you even get a free DVD!)

Jeremy.

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 2:12:00 PM, Blogger Aaron Shafovaloff said...

So it's wrong and offensive to ask an embarrassing doctrinal question to Mormons? I'd like to hear about the kind of ethical system that mandates this.

Show me from official Mormon doctrine where the possibility of God the Father having once been a practicing homosexual before a conversion is precluded, then I will retract the question and apologize for it. As it is, official Mormon doctrine doesn't preclude it. In fact, traditional Mormon doctrine (specifically, the traditional understanding of Lorenzo Snow couplet theoogy) suggests such a possibility, since God once lived a mortal probation like us and a person here on earth can practice such sin and then repent unto Celestial exaltation and godhood.

As for Alonzo Gaskill, I documented my email exchange with him, and it is on JesusNotJoseph.com. I used his concession--that we "probably" have to believe that God the Father was once a sinner--as part of a larger argument that Mormonism doesn't preclude God the Father from ever possibly having been a practicing homosexual. The context was a few Mormons claiming that Mormonism absolutely, doctrinally, and certainly precludes the possibility of God the Father from having once been a sinner at all. Gaskill's concession was meant to serve as a rebuttal to that. I made it very clear that I never intended to communicate that Gaskill agreed with my larger argument, but simply used him to further demonstrate that traditional Lorenzo Snow couplet theology does not preclude God the Father from having once been a sinner. Gaskill obviously didn't like me using his embarrassing words to establish a premise to further my larger argument.

"So, he taught that it was possible that God the Father could have sinned, but then you took that and ran with it, to ridiculous lengths, right?"

No, not in the sense of making grandiose inferences from what he alone said. Read the full series of threads. Gaskill's embarrassing concession was used along with other evidence to support my larger argument.

"I want everyone to know who you really are Aaron and no, I wouldn't do a Skypecast with you if someone paid me good money, because I don't want anything to do with you or Eric, or any of you who believe like this and condemn all Mormons to fry in hell."

If you didn't want to have anything to do with us, you wouldn't be conversing with us, and you certainly wouldn't be trying to smear me. Would you rather use the "safer" medium of a blog rather than put yourself out on the line with a live audio conversation?

If you change your mind, my Skype s/n is aaronshaf.

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 2:24:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Aaron Shafovaloff, are you homophobic?

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 2:36:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hello,
I just read an interesting article about the top-secret Jesus Christ/Joseph Smith video, and wanted to post it. It is very detailed and analyzes how LDS members might perceive the video.
http://johnwmorehead.blogspot.com/2007/02/jesus-christjoseph-smith-video_10.html
Sorry to interrupt your heated discussion though.

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 3:15:00 PM, Blogger Eric Hoffman said...

Samuel,
This poster named Jeremy is the same exact person who sent you emails threatening you to remove the post or suffer a possible hack. Jeremy is also:

-Greg
-Robert
-Dharma12
-Jane Winsley
-Martin (you probably remember Martin. he was a homosexual who slammed me about 9 months ago. You took sides with him.)
-True Christian
-Danny

Man, he has been so many people, it's rediculous.
If Jeremy wants to respond he can. He is the one who sent me an email and posed as this "Stephen Kinley."
Just thought you should know, Samuel that the attacks are from within your own blogger fans.
I encourage you to take Aaron up on his offer. I dont know what you have to loose.
You say he is not worth your time, but you sure have spent a lot of "time" speaking about him.
Personally I feel that your decline is a sign of weakness. Take him up on it. You are willing to spend countless hours here debating him. Why not over an audible enviroment??

God Bless,
-Eric Hoffman
Galatians 4:16

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 4:02:00 PM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Eric, you and Aaron can take a hike and take your arrogant, condemning, homophobic(God might have been a "practicing homosexual" or a "homosexual drag queen" bullshit with you. It appears that this guy, if it really is him(you don't know for sure) is also a big fan of your blog, so I could say he came from you. Don't link him to me, as if all of this is my fault. What, you think I'm buds with all these guys that I've never even met and we hang out and they are my puppets and I'm pulling the strings? Are you really that delusional?

And dude, what's with having to always point out that your poster Martin is a HOMOSEXUAL? You just said it now and you said in a voice mail to me.....I mean shit dude, how homophobic are you? Do you go around saying, "hey, this is my friend Aaron, the heterosexual and here's my other friend Martin, and he's a homosexual?" You say you have gay friends? Is this how you treat them? It seems that you and Aaron are just obsessed with homosexuality? Why is this?

Also Eric, quit being such a pussy and claiming that I'm weak and afraid of Aaron or something. What is this, playground in grade school? GO FUCK YOURSELF!!

Was I afraid of you the other night? Did I say things to you that you said I'd never dare to say to you, that I'd written in my blog. You and Aaron are nothing but schoolyard bullies and I detest anyone like you and I always have.

I freaking embarrassed the shit out of you and schooled you 2 weeks ago(and exposed you as the damn liar you truly are), which everyone will soon hear and I have no need to wast more of my time or that of my listeners, debating some clearly homophobic asshole(in my opinion), that goes around with you, openly condemning ALL Mormons in the name of your God/Jesus and love. There is nothing to gain by anyone on my side, to debate such losers.

The only reason I've even engaged Aaron here at all, was because he left comments and I felt the need to defend myself and expose him, just like I exposed you 8 months ago and again 2 weeks ago....I said what I had to say about you and I was done and I will do the same with Aaron. You were the one that kept calling and leaving comments, basically begging to be my friend.

Everyone here and over on the Mormon Apologetics board and other places linking here, now know what you and Aaron are all about and I'm content. I'll talk to who I want, when I want, how I want and I'm not going to give into bullies saying, "you're weak" or "afraid", when you damn well know that nobody intimidates me and if you don't know that by now, your dumber than I thought you were.

Yeah, I'm so fucking weak and intimidated, that I take on the Mormon Hierarchy every day and I exposed your little DVD plan to the world, knowing that I'd be facing a shit storm from you guys. You honestly have ZERO ability to ascertain another persons courage and strength and you honestly think that you intimidate people? Are you serious? Get over yourself!!

After all the times I've embarrassed you and shown you for the hypocrite you are, I thought you'd learn, but no such luck. Now, go crawl back into your fanatical, Evangelical hole with Aaron and talk about God the Father possibly being a "homosexual drag queen" and that "Martin was a homosexual" and that people might come to my blog to "get off." Oh yeah, I forgot, you never made that last comment did you? LIAR!!

God bless my ass!!

Samuel

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 7:32:00 PM, Blogger eric said...

Samuel, my, what vocabulary you have. Let nobody accuse you of harboring repressed anger. Just let it all out, baby.

My only question is, why would "they" (referring to the Evangelicals) want to fiddle with your site? The publicity you and others are creating for the DVD will far surpass any "surprise factor" that you apparently think the distributors so desperately want. Yet if people flock to watch it at google video (where a Mormon has posted it) or await at their doorsteps for someone to deliver it at the end of the month, then you have actually done the distributor a great service by creating a demand that probably would never have been there in the first place... without all the free publicity.

And as far as the fear factor, I highly doubt that the Mormon "hierarchy" or the film's producers are shaking in their boots--you really do give yourself far too much credit for scaring both camps. That extended arm of yours, why, it must be really tired from continually patting yourself on the back. Perhaps you ought to give it a rest. ;)

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:05:00 PM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

First of all, it was THEY, THE DISTRIBUTORS, who had a "secret plan" and didn't want any Mormons to see their video or even know about their plan, until March 25, was it not? Are you in the twilight zone pal? Oh, and did my four letter words offend you? And oh yeah, I will let it out whenever I damn well please, BECAUSE IT'S MY BLOG!! If you don't like it go read and post somewhere else, like Aaron or Eric's blogs and forums...I'm sure they'd love to have you and need you at this point.

It wasn't I who came up with this plan, to be kept TOP-SECRET from all Mormons, and you'd know that if you'd actually bothered to read anything that has been posted, starting with their official letter, that was handed out with each DVD. Did you think I made that up? Then again, I'm sure you're just being selective on what you are saying, knowing full well what is happening here.

But hey, I don't know how else to express myself to Eric Hoffman, regarding what I think of him, after failing repeatedly since last June, when trying to be nice and perfectly clear, that I didn't ever want a damn thing to do with him and his blanket condemnations again. He's now obsessed with not having enemies, even though he is openly condemning people that don't believe what he does. I keep hoping that he'll understand the four letter word, but I guess he doesn't get that either.

So a week or so ago, Aaron Shaf. and others were in complete despair and mental/spiritual agony, about all the churches that wouldn't participate and felt that it was Satan wielding his evil forces against their pathetic project and were asking people to pray that their hearts would be opened...now I'm a Godsend(the answer to those prayers) and basically a hero and tool in the hand of their God? Yeah, right!!

Okay, so now, because they have no choice and I busted their little bullshit DVD door-to-door plan, people feel that it was a blessing and that their amazing God used me, to make it all happen. Now, that’s funny!!

Well, I'm just glad that I could help you guys out, but trust me, it has had a far more negative impact, than a positive one, because people now know what some of your guys are all about. They are over on the MAD boards either writing serious reviews, of the video and pretty much slamming it or mocking the shit out of it and have a big laugh. This was the goal of the DVD? Also, if they just wanted to put up the DVD on Google, that’s what they would have done, instead of sending out hundreds of thousands of DVDs, right?

And why is everyone going to be standing there on March 25, waiting for their DVD, when it offends most of them and they think it’s complete crap? Maybe for the bonfire up the canyon? Do you or anyone else out there, honestly think that they are really happy about this turn of events and think that it is a “blessing” and has put them in a good light, and has earned the respect of Mormons and others in the Utah community and that they are going to get a lot of converts with this project? It has had the exact opposite affect and is now a complete fiasco and embarrassment for them.

I’m sure these Evangelical, self-proclaimed Mormon lovers, who openly condemn them all, in the name of their God/Jesus, have better and more important things to be doing and looking for, than lurking here and posting their bullshit on my blog? Then again, maybe not!!

I notice that Aaron has vanished off of MAD, after they posted his ridiculous post and picture of “God the Father might have been a homosexual drag queen.” Was that picture of Aaron one asked? LOL!! They called him out and he cut and ran, which was no surprise to anyone there. They're all waiting for you Aaron, to explain that post and picture to them and how you are such a great guy.

Amazing the methods these guys think will bring Mormons into their flock, isn’t it? It’s like they say to themselves, “let’s find the most offensive thing we possibly can, to confront and really piss of all the Mormons(like openly mocking their God), then mock them, ridicule them, openly condemn them, and convert them. WTF? Yeah, I’m sure the Mormons are just flooding through their doors as we speak....LOL!!

Samuel

 
At Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:37:00 PM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Hey everyone, I've said what I want to say about these guys, I've helped(along with everyone over at MAD and the others who linked to the story) to expose their secret DVD plan and for me, there's no further need to debate them or waste my time any further. I know what they are, most people out there that have been reading all of this, that aren't a part of their group, know what they are and what their game is and the game is OVER.

If they want to continue calling me out, saying that I'm weak, because I won't debate them further, like schoolyard bullies, then that's fine, but it will be one sided and just further make them like the asses they have shown everyone they are. Honestly, at this point, I'm just laughing about it, I really am, because they are so pathetic.

So, go do your thing guys, get back to your famous blanket condemnation of all the Mormons, and good luck getting converts. I'm glad that I could be such a "blessing" in their lives and help them so much, to get this DVD project off and running so smoothly, 2 weeks prior to their "secret launch date", that NO Mormons were ever supposed to know about.

At least everyone can now see the video over on Google, which should help them a ton with the door-to-door distribution. It's already a huge hit over on the MAD boards, as people are already converting to Evangelic Christianity, right in the middle of their posts. It's an amazing thing to behold. I think I might even convert...holy shit, did I just say that? The power is so strong, I just can't deny it any longer...wow, I snapped out of it just in time...LOL!!

It's been an honor guys and good luck with that project of yours as I'm sure the phones are ringing off the hook as we speak, the parking lot is full and your counselors are gonna be pulling 24-48 hour alternating shifts, to handle all of the Mormon converts begging for conversion to your ideology.

Samuel

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 12:09:00 AM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Hey Sinister, welcome back, sincerely. I really and truly appreciate your offer and concern, despite our past differences and thanks for defending my constitutional protected right of expression as I would yours, if you were threatened. I think you caught me at a really bad time before, when I was pretty pissed off and dealing with several familial and friend issues, ex-Mormons, TBM apologists and then the Evangelicals were the cherry on top. Then you came along complaining about how long my posts were or something and well, I know I let you have it. Maybe we can try this again, under better circumstances?

We'll probably never agree on how long my posts should be, as I could complain that yours aren't long enough, but who cares really and that's why they call them "personal blogs", right? We each have our own style and way of doing things and a lot of people are very happy with my blog and thank me all the time and I’m sure you receive the same Emails. Life would get pretty boring if we were all the same, wrote the same, etc. Different strokes for different folks and different blogs for different folks too. If my blog isn’t what they are looking for, maybe yours is, or Galatian's or Misfit Marie's, etc. There’s a blog out there for everyone and mine certainly aren't for everyone and I’ll be the first to admit that.

It's all good though and I find it interesting that the activities of these fanatical Evangelicals and whoever threatened to hack my blog, is actually having a polarizing affect of uniting people that usually aren't united, like us, the MAD people, linking to my blog and posting my comments, etc. It’s funny how several of the Evangelicals were outraged that I’d suggest they had something to do with it, but then went on to say it was probably a Mormon, trying to discredit them. Once again, the hypocrisy I speak of, for all to see, like a light on a hill that cannot be hidden.

Right now, I'm respecting the hell out of several of the individuals over at MAD, for their support of what I announced and they’re letting these Evangelicals have it, and deservedly so. I appreciate Spencer the most, even though we’ve never talked that I’m aware of(if we have, I apologize). I appreciate him posting my comments, posts and links to my blogs, so that everyone could get a good and honest handle on this situation. The guy has been very fair with me, and has even defended me against personal attacks by Aaron Shaf, which I really appreciate, since I don't even post over there.

I just felt very strongly, that the Mormons didn’t deserve to be blind-sided by this and I accomplished my goal. I'm very much out in the open, I don't hide anything or how I feel about Mormonism and I don't feel that these guys should either. Why the need for secrecy and trickery, if you believe strongly in what you are doing and saying?

Anyway, take care Sinister and I apologize for not putting up a link to your blog a long time ago, since you’ve been linking to mine for quite a while. Take care and thanks again,

Samuel

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 4:45:00 AM, Blogger Misfit Marie said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 5:17:00 AM, Blogger Misfit Marie said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 6:14:00 AM, Blogger Misfit Marie said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 6:25:00 AM, Blogger Misfit Marie said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 6:46:00 AM, Anonymous ray said...

Hi Jose,

Dude, take a step back and look at what you are doing. Posting under a dozen different names, some anti-Samuel, some pro-Samuel, some anti-Christian, some pro-Christian...

Do you know why no one takes you serious? Because you are a damn psycho and even YOU don't know what you're trying to say. How much more confusing for all the rest of us?

One day you're a branch president, next day you're a sailor, next day you're not Christian, next day you're Samuel's buddy, next day you're Jose the jerk, next day you're a buddhist. Why don't you be Side Show Bob tomorrow. That would be your most fitting disguise.

You are showing signs of a pretty mentally distrubed person. By the way, what exactly would you do if you find out where Samuel 'lives'? Would you follow your hero Brigham Young and Blood Atone him?

I tried to be nice and civil with you but now I'm going to repeat Samuel's words and tell you to FUCK OFF! Then again, maybe it's better that you're here where you can't actually hurt anyone. I guess it's better that you're here rather than out on the street Blood Atoning everyone who doesn't agree with you.

You are the ultimate example of why Samuel has such a low tolerance of TBM's, if that's what you really are. Maybe you're just here for your own kicks to get everyone riled up; very funny. Maybe you really are a psycho. Who knows?

But the bottom line is that whoever you are, we don't harass you. In fact, we don't harass anyone. We are all right here and all the psychopaths and nut jobs come here to confront us. And then we get accused of being angry and evil, when it is EVERYONE ELSE who comes here and starts the fight.

I'm sure you're over on Eric's blog messing with him too. In fact, you're probably the same psycho who posts there under a dozen different names, and I wouldn't be surprised one little bit if YOU sent the threatening e-mail to Samuel.

Why do you get off by causing so much trouble? Then you have the nerve to accuse us of being hate-filled and whatnot. You are the ultimate example of hypocrite. Why don't you just stick to one name, and stick to one story... that way someone might take you a little seriously.

Marie is right. Samuel's real name has nothing to do with anything. You're so obsessed with who he really is, but you don't even know who you are. You get upset because Samuel uses an alias, but look at you! Half of the posts in the last month are you using a dozen different names. So quit your damn whining you non-christian, lamanite, brown-boy, branch president, Samuel lover, Samuel hater, Evangelical, sailor, and whatever else you have been in the last month.

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 11:26:00 AM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Thanks Misfit Marie and Ray for your support. Yeah, this guy is so far mentally gone, that there is no hope for him. I deleted all of his comments again(it has to be over 50-60 now that I've deleted), so it looks like you guys are talking to yourself, and I just wanted everyone to know why that is.

This Jose guy must be the same guy Eric spoke of yesterday(which he claims is fan of mine) and like you said Ray, the guy that threatened my blog(and now me personally) and I'm guessing the one that sent Eric that Email claiming he was going to hack my blog and wanted his help, etc.

Eric says he has posted under:

-Greg -Robert -Dharma12 -Jane Winsley -Martin -True Christian -Danny

I have so many comments from so many people, and so much going on, that I haven't really tracked him that closely, as Eric apparently has and Eric could probably tell me all the names he's used on my blog as well, in addition to the ones we already know about for sure, some of which Ray has posted above. It's obvious he has nothing else to do with his life, isn't it?

I'm guessing this is the same guy, and it all makes sense now. I think he must have escaped from the nut house and they're out looking for his sorry ass as we speak and I hope they find him, lock him up and throw away the key. To be honest, this guy or person is scary, capable of probably anything and I advise all who he is bothering, and obsessing over, including Eric, Marie, myself and anybody else, to watch your back.

This guy is that type that would implement Briggy's blood atonement and if he comes to my house, I'll be prepared for him, and ready to defend myself, believe me. It's downright scary to know that there are people like this running around the streets free, looking to harm anyone they can.

Come to think of it, this is probably that Billsjane asshole too, that was obsessed with me and calling me a fagot all the time and many other terms I won't go into, as they've already been detailed on my hatemail post. He sent me 25 or so Emails, some threatening, all offensive and vulgar and I reported him to AOL 3 times.

Well, take care guys, as it looks like the Evangelicals have put themselves on ice, thank the Mormon God and now we can get on with what is really important.

The Skypecast tonight will probably only be an hour, because hey, IT'S MARCH MADNESS BABY, my favorite time of the year, other than the SuperBowl of course.

Samuel

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 12:40:00 PM, Blogger Spencer said...

Samuel,

Spencer here ("Smac" over on the MAD board). I'm surprised at how much attention your little ol' post has received. To the extent I facilitated a whackjob making threats against your blog, I apologize. I didn't intend to encourage such things.

Thanks,

-Spencer

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 1:10:00 PM, Blogger The Sinister Porpoise said...

I think it was something else to be honest, but it doesn't matter. I would make the same offers to the people who were attacking you were the situation reversed.

That's the thing about free speech. It applies even to people who say things you don't like.

I like to keep my blog posts short so I don't lose the reader's attention. I happen to think this site would do better with a slightly different format, perhaps as an e-zine published regularly.

Of course you'd need more authors for that. Perhaps it would be a worthy project to start a magazine for those with any interest in Mormonism, pro, con or otherwise.

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 1:46:00 PM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

I can't remember exactly what it was either, but I guess I can go look it up and see. The purpose of my site from day one, was to have a place where I could come to express myself openly, freely, with no restrictions or guidelines, supported by facts and links whenever possible.

This is a place for me to vent, share personal experiences or those of others, that want to share them here, without being terrified or worried about how long they are or if I'm going to "lose people's interest."

We're over 100,000 hits now, with over 8,000 in January, over 9,000 in February and we're heading for around 12,000-14,000 for March, which will be the best month yet and the third straight best month for hits. So, I would say that people aren't losing interest, rather gaining interest and it is increasing in popularity because the posts are not short, rather long and thorough.

For me, it isn't about how long or short they are, rather about getting the WHOLE message out there, complete, whether it takes them 2 hours to read it or 10 minutes. If people were so upset at the length of my posts, I'd be getting a few hundred hits a week and decreasing, but the facts point to the exact opposite and I'm just gonna keep doing what I'm doing, because it works. I didn't realize that there was a set standard for blogs, that all posts must be kept short? Good thing they don't have that on books, or we'd be out some of the greatest books of all time, wouldn't we?

People have said the same thing about my podcasts being too long and so that must be why(I've really only recorded one over the last 8 months) I'm now getting over 30,000 downloads a months and Emails everyday from new people finding them and loving them, claiming they are addicted to them and listening to them over and over.

Look, the bottom line, like I said in the previous message, is that there is something for everyone and a lot of people have chosen this something, which I'm proud of. I thankful to all of those who participate here and have made this happen, as I couldn't have done it without their support and participation.

Mormon Truth has become a safe haven for many people to come to and express themselves openly and we will only continue to find new readers and listeners as time goes on and more people leave the Mormon church.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it, right? I'm sorry that you don't find it to be something that interests you, but I'm not worried about the small minority, rather the large majority(that loves, participates in and enjoys this blog), which is growing monthly.

Thanks everyone for all of your support as always,

Samuel

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 6:11:00 PM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Hey, in case anyone reads this and is wondering when the Skypecast will be today...it will probably be after 10 PM Mountain time tonight(like around 10:30) and probably only for an hour. Next week things should be back to normal.

Hey Spencer, I have a comment that I started for you and I'll post it later tonight. I wasn't ignoring you, rather I just wanted to finish the comment. Thanks for being so cool and for linking to my blog and even defending me against these guys, while helping point out the true nature of the individuals involved, like Aaron.

I'm glad that I could help out the Mormons in this case, to know about the "secret plans" of the Evangelicals, which in my opinion, were under-handed, unethical and just plain wrong and offensive.

If they really believed so strongly in their "one and only God/Jesus" and their so called truth, that damns all Mormons and the whole world to burn in eternal flames; they wouldn't have to resort to "TOP-SECRET" plans, would they? I find it very ironic and hypocritical on their part. At least they have lost all credibility and can no longer accuse Mormons of "secret combinations", right?

Take care everyone,

Samuel

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 11:36:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"we don't harass you. In fact, we don't harass anyone" that's BS; you harass every leader/apostle in the church and insult them regualarly.

And I don't think this Jose is here to discuss the issues: he has a pychotic hatred of Samuel, thinks his the devil, or at least a modern Judas, so he won't be friendly and consistent in his postings, I think, or sane for that matter. He is here to fight only. People need to ignore him to avoid the fight. And Samuel needs to keep his true identity a secret because of these TBM pychos out there.
Just a my opinion.
Keep up the good work guys.

Bond

 
At Thursday, March 15, 2007 11:40:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hey fagot Samuel,

You are lucky that the mormon god has some use for you, as the opposition to all things on the web.

I won't be so patient or tolerant of you.

Billsjane

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 12:02:00 AM, Anonymous ray said...

How so? By calling their lies? That's not harassing. I have never sent an email or comment directly to president Hinckley and told him he's an asshole and that I will kill him if I get the chance. I voice my opinion about them here but that is hardly harassing, especially if what I am saying is true, or at least what I preceive to be true. I do not threaten them, nor do I have any desire to harm them.

If I call a person a liar, that is my opinion, not an insult, although the person might take it as an insult. Jose harasses because we have repeatedly asked him to stop and go away, but he persists. He has also threatened Samuel and if that isn't harassment, I don't know what is. No ex-Mormon here, that I am aware of, has threated anyone.

Bond... Didn't Jose admit that Bond was one of his names? If you're not Jose, then who's side are you on anyway? I always assumed you were one of us...

Samuel, notice how the last two comments from Bond and from Billsjane are only 4 minutes apart? Kinda makes you go, hmmm.

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 8:29:00 AM, Blogger Elder Joseph said...

hey

That Billsjane character is not a Mormon really . He's excommunicated from what he has admitted to me on You Tube . So no need to take him seriousley.I think he posts on You tube under billabong and bills3d or something like that I reckon ... He's got a little pyschological problem I think .

Elder Joseph

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 8:47:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

--------"we don't harass you. In fact, we don't harass anyone" that's BS; you harass every leader/apostle in the church and insult them regualarly.

And I don't think this Jose is here to discuss the issues: he has a pychotic hatred of Samuel, thinks his the devil, or at least a modern Judas, so he won't be friendly and consistent in his postings, I think, or sane for that matter. He is here to fight only. People need to ignore him to avoid the fight. And Samuel needs to keep his true identity a secret because of these TBM pychos out there.
Just a my opinion.
Keep up the good work guys.

Bond------

Whomever this is, STOP USING MY FUCKING HANDLE!!!!!!

Bond...James Bond

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 10:05:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Ray,

The handle I go by is Bond...James Bond. I post at mormondiscussions.com by that handle (I also posted at mormonapologetics.org by that handle, till I was banned). Read any of my posts over there and you'll realize that I'm definitely a critic of the church. Someone is signing off as "Bond" in an attempt to discredit me or whatever.

Bond...James Bond

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 10:18:00 AM, Blogger Bond...James Bond said...

Test post

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 10:20:00 AM, Blogger Bond...James Bond said...

Hopefully this new profile thing will help avoid confusion. Whoever was posting as me before (twice I said stop posting as me) stop POSTING AS BOND!!!! GET YOUR OWN NAME AND STICK TOO IT!!!

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 10:37:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

A person with paranoid schizophrenia misinterprets experiences and then holds on to those interpretations despite evidence or reasoning to the contrary. Delusions and auditory hallucinations are the prominent psychotic symptoms in people with paranoid schizophrenia.

Delusions are commonly focused on the perception of being persecuted and often result in the mistrust of other people - THE EVANGELISTS ARE TRYING TO HACK INTO MY BLOG - THE MORMON HIERARCHY WANTS TO SHUT ME DOWN - THIS GUY IS THE TYPE THAT WOULD IMPLEMENT BRIGGY'S BLOOD ATONEMENT AND IF HE COMES TO MY HOUSE, I'LL BE PREPARED FOR HIM, AND READY TO DEFEND MYSELF -

A person with paranoid schizophrenia may also have delusions of grandeur - I AM GOING TO DESTROY A HUGE ORGANIZATION LIKE THE MORMON CHURCH WITH MY BLOG - I CAN STOP THE EVANGELISTS FROM DISTRIBUTING THEIR DVDS TO MORMONS -

Delusions may result in a violent outburst if a person believes a perceived threat creates a dangerous situation in need of self-defense - WHAT IS THIS, PLAYGROUND IN GRADE SCHOOL? GO F--- YOURSELF!!

Delusions can become complex stories, and interpretations of experiences often "confirm" the person's view of reality - JOSEPH SMITH IS A PEDOPHILE, BRIGHAM YOUNG CONDONES MURDER, MORMONS ARE RACIST -

Hmmmmmmmmmm, could Samuel fall into this category?????????????

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 2:16:00 PM, Anonymous ray said...

Bond, the read Bond,

Sorry about the confusion.

Anon,

There is a difference between paranoid schizophrenia and a real threat, which Samuel has received many of. I am quite sure that there are those out there who would do Samuel harm if they knew who he was (you?). Is being prepared a sign of mental weakness? If it is, then all Mormons with a food storage must be paranoid too.

Delusions of grandeur... hmmm, how about the belief that your god is all powerful and will stomp out anyone who opposes you. How about the belief that you literally hold the power of god?

Samuel will never be able to stop the church from growing, and he knows it. His self proclaimed purpose is not to destroy the church but to expose their lies and help people out who are struggling.

How is it a delusion when you can see, in black and white, Brigham Young's own words when he said he would murder his wife on the spot? And again his own words when he prophesied that the Civil War WOULD NOT end slavery? He said it is/was god's will that the black man should serve the white man, forever! If anyone is delusional, it is your little hero Brigham.

***********************************

Samuel,

Not to tell you what to do with your blog, but perhaps the time has come to only allow registered users to post comments. This deal with Jose is getting out of hand and the only way to get rid of him is to ban all of the names he posts under.

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 3:40:00 PM, Anonymous Joy said...

Samuel,

It's time to get some security up here. Ray is completely right. Whether it's finally setting up a messageboard where membership is a requirement to post, or porting all of your material over to typekey which has better security (anyone can register on blogger with an anyonymous name, it won't help the issue).

I've been quietly reading for awhile, and the shenanigans have to stop. And I am shocked that grown men are behaving in such a way.

Good work as always Samuel, and I hope to catch one of your Skypecasts soon!

 
At Friday, March 16, 2007 4:02:00 PM, Blogger Samuel the Utahnite said...

Thanks Ray for the comment and suggestion and sadly, I must agree with you. I've been tossing it around now for weeks, trying not to give in to such a pathetic asshole and make everyone else have to pay for his disgusting words...but I guess I have no other choice now, as he is a true psychopath and won't ever stop. He is making it extremely unpleasant for everyone here and needs psychological help, which we can't, nor want to provide for him.

It's amazing how I try to have a place where EVERYONE can come to express themselves freely and then we have to have people like this loser, throwing out racist, bigoted terms and threats to everyone. I mean my tolerance level is extremely high, as you and everyone knows and it takes a real son of a bitch like this, to consider it crossing the line.

I've never deleted another person's comments on any of my blogs(including many who hate my guts), other than the person that said Joy was drunk, which I later re-posted with her okay and we blasted the guy. Come to think of it, that was probably "Jose" too, even back then, since Billsjane has been stalking me for over a year and a half now.

I'll probably try having everyone register first and if that doesn't work(and he registers all 30+ of his names, since he apparently has nothing else to do with his F'd up life), then finally, I'll have to enable full comment moderation by myself and no comments will be posted until I approve them, with the option of rejecting and deleting whatever I want to.

I hate to do it, but this just can't continue, as I've probably deleted at least 70+ of his comments now. Damn, if he can't post his comments here anymore, 20 times a day, I wonder what he'll use as a "turn on" to "get off."

Anyway, thanks Ray and I'm gonna respond to the other asshole that you responded to. Man what is this, "assholes coming out of the woodwork week?" I wonder if they are a Mormon or an Evangelical or if it was just Billsjane again? Who knows and who cares!!

By the way, Billsjane's IP number with AOL, for over a year now, is 64.12.137.5, if anyone out there would like to trace it further and find out where he lives and who he really is, as AOL doesn't really seem to give a damn!! Any help in this regard would be great guys!!

His Email address is Billsjane@aol.com. You can Google his name or Email address and see the comment he left on Salamander Society, back on 5/30/2004, saying "You are filthy anti-Mormon scum!

There is also a "Billsjane" on Ebay, from the UK, and who knows if that is the same person or not. If it is, he's pretty stupid to be using that name on Ebay, but then what would we expect, right?

Take care Ray, and thanks everyone for your support,

Samuel

 

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